DeletedUser
Diminishing returns for hp seems like punishment for bad behavior. Improving other skills will encourage good behavior and is more likely to meet acceptance by the community as a whole.
DeletedUser23629
1) This is a very small and pointless matter to even argue in the first place.
2) Not sure where you all play, but I don't think there's any issue whatsoever with battles being too short.
3) Taking leadership bonus away will be boring? It does virtually nothing and just gives people a reason to complain about soldiers having too many bonus's. I play two worlds, one a soldier with 9,600 health points and the other I am a worker. I am far from worried about players "being better than me." Once again, this is getting personal instead of constructive.
4) I misunderstand how fort battles work? This is something I don't think I need to argue at all, as I've proved to know more than most on the subject.
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I agree, I like the diminishing effects of more HP more than anything else proposed in this topic. If I am stirring things up and getting some activity going here, then I accomplished what I hoped for
I like what kayak proposed way back when, and I still do.
DeletedUser
Then so is diminishing returns on leadership, aim, dodging, hiding, and stamina.
And again, that will punish the less specialized fort fighters instead of fort battles being accessible to everyone.
DeletedUser30224
Well, I tried to do something constructive...and all the other options sounded just ... little "fluffy" if you know what I mean. I disagree with you there...I have no hard data, but if you apply the formula to HP as in hp^0.4, you need 500 HP to go 12 points...that is 12+10+ some clothes ... around 26 chance to dodge ...almost nothing, but still 25% people will miss when shooting at you.
I was thinking more along those lines, that in the same manner as they "improved" the AIM and DODGE for duelers, they can put some, or allot of emphasis to fort fighting skills...along with the option to choose them many bonuses that everybody keeps talking that we will get one day.
Maybe that would not solve our problem either ... if you just wear the clothes you get more than plenty bonus to keep all that HP on your side ... and HP counts allot...eeh, this beats me
DeletedUser
sure, it doesn't matter what gets changed as long as it's something good.
leadership, hiding, and stamina are used for jobs, and you can't be a good dueler if you don't specialize anyways....less specialized fort fighters are already excluded from fort battles and hp is useless for anything else.
DeletedUser
You don't need 260 people to fill a duel.
Low hp is only really excluded from small battles (at least on my worlds). On w11, w12, and older worlds, you'll almost always get into a medium or large if you're online.
DeletedUser30307
I had posted my views earlier, but will do so again in lieu of the original post having being amended.
- This is solely from the point of FFing and does not take into account boxes/exp/dueling etc.
1) Remove the dueler class fort advantage of landing a critical hit. - NO
- I have not consulted my records/stats but usually i get about 2-3 crit hits in a battle. That is hardly anything if the crits are not on tanks and it only makes a difference if they land on tanks.
2) Add a possible critical hit for ALL classes - MAYBE
- If this is to be adopted then it should be in conjunction with no.3. Essentially not required if other measures make the current tanks skill out of HP.
3) Add a new advantage for duelers class - MAYBE
- This should be adopted if no.2 is being adopted. This feature looses its value if in case tanks do skill out of HP for some reason, then this will only serve the purpose of KOing a low HP player who is hiding behind another player (one less gun) & will not serve the purpose of aiming at tanks as presumably they would have skilled out of HP and all players will have similar HP.
4) Improve the impact of other skills in fort battles - YES.
- This factor alone will balance FFing and the rest of the factors will not need consideration. Making the other virtually redundant FFing skills will itself make soldiers skill out of HP. Imagine tanks who 'always' get hit and are never able to 'dodge' a shot....no need for a single crit as they would be reskilling out of HP at the earliest.
5) Remove the Soldier leadership bonus - NO
- Lets not nerf them totally if in case something is done and HP looses its value, what will soldiers be left with ?
- Note 1 : With any/all of the above changes, premium ADVs will become even more powerful and the obvious choice of character. Hence if anything is done then the ghosting % should be reduced, as it is a premium ADV can last more than 5 rounds on the flag all by himself or block sectors stopping the opposition from advancing. These things do happen quite often and should also be addressed if & when other suggestions are implemented.
- Note 2 : with all/any of the above changes (especially with no.2 where all classes get crit hits). Attackers will become 'much more' powerful and that ought to imbalance FFing. Imagine 100 attackers rushing towards two towers with crit hits, the defenders will be dropping like flies....or if the duelers (with targetting) from the attacking side are able to drop the players in the rear of the towers etc. Only premium ADVs might be able to hold the towers/walls in this case.
The above is my opinion of what I could think off at present....obviously I could be wrong and by all means please do correct me if i'm wrong.
hash
- This is solely from the point of FFing and does not take into account boxes/exp/dueling etc.
1) Remove the dueler class fort advantage of landing a critical hit. - NO
- I have not consulted my records/stats but usually i get about 2-3 crit hits in a battle. That is hardly anything if the crits are not on tanks and it only makes a difference if they land on tanks.
2) Add a possible critical hit for ALL classes - MAYBE
- If this is to be adopted then it should be in conjunction with no.3. Essentially not required if other measures make the current tanks skill out of HP.
3) Add a new advantage for duelers class - MAYBE
- This should be adopted if no.2 is being adopted. This feature looses its value if in case tanks do skill out of HP for some reason, then this will only serve the purpose of KOing a low HP player who is hiding behind another player (one less gun) & will not serve the purpose of aiming at tanks as presumably they would have skilled out of HP and all players will have similar HP.
4) Improve the impact of other skills in fort battles - YES.
- This factor alone will balance FFing and the rest of the factors will not need consideration. Making the other virtually redundant FFing skills will itself make soldiers skill out of HP. Imagine tanks who 'always' get hit and are never able to 'dodge' a shot....no need for a single crit as they would be reskilling out of HP at the earliest.
5) Remove the Soldier leadership bonus - NO
- Lets not nerf them totally if in case something is done and HP looses its value, what will soldiers be left with ?
- Note 1 : With any/all of the above changes, premium ADVs will become even more powerful and the obvious choice of character. Hence if anything is done then the ghosting % should be reduced, as it is a premium ADV can last more than 5 rounds on the flag all by himself or block sectors stopping the opposition from advancing. These things do happen quite often and should also be addressed if & when other suggestions are implemented.
- Note 2 : with all/any of the above changes (especially with no.2 where all classes get crit hits). Attackers will become 'much more' powerful and that ought to imbalance FFing. Imagine 100 attackers rushing towards two towers with crit hits, the defenders will be dropping like flies....or if the duelers (with targetting) from the attacking side are able to drop the players in the rear of the towers etc. Only premium ADVs might be able to hold the towers/walls in this case.
The above is my opinion of what I could think off at present....obviously I could be wrong and by all means please do correct me if i'm wrong.
hash
DeletedUser
Attackers being much more powerful is a good thing....owning a fort is not a right, it's a privilege. And to address Elmyr, more battles could always be called to accommodate everybody....it's already starting to happen on w15.
DeletedUser
Moot Discussion...
It would seem that waiting until this happens and then re-opening the discussion would be sensible since this change might completely alter this whole 'balancing' issue...
It would seem that waiting until this happens and then re-opening the discussion would be sensible since this change might completely alter this whole 'balancing' issue...
DeletedUser
Yet it can happen that it's not connected to the idea in the topic as the topic deals only with fort bonuses and the roadmap perhaps plans to change all bonuses except the ones used in fort battles.
Add more to that speculation of mine: while avatars are compatible to the new roadmap system (you can't know who's what class based on the new avatar), in the fort you can see via icons who took which class.
As I've said previously, when and if this idea comes to vote, I'll say no. No need to repeat why, I hope.
But The Roadmap is not the reason to freeze the idea until changes to bonuses are made.
DeletedUser
I, personally, think it's better to present an idea now instead of waiting until you end up with something you might not have wanted. Develop the idea, ask for a poll, and see where the chips fall. If it gets presented to the developers, who knows, maybe they'll --- adjust --- their present plans and actions and accommodate your recommends.
DeletedUser9470
well we have asked over and over for fort skills to be taken into account.
can we not have a poll on that for a start?
can we not have a poll on that for a start?
DeletedUser
I second the motion.
DeletedUser
fair point, I just figured maybe they were ignoring this post due to Roadmap, but I definitely agree with the principle of this post finding 'balance' in some form
DeletedUser
Nah, it's not being ignored. When it's ready, or Peter008 feels it's ready, a nomination can be posed at this thread -- http://forum.the-west.net/showthread.php?t=31017
DeletedUser30224
6) Extend worker's bonus on all fort buildings not just their tower.
That is how I would like it
DeletedUser
6) Extend worker's bonus on all fort buildings not just their tower.
That is how I would like it
Worker bonus DOES apply to all towers.
YOUR sector is whatever sector YOU are in. The improvement would be if the sector bonus applied to the worker tower class bonus as well and not just the worker tower sector bonus that everyone gets.
DeletedUser30224
Didn't know that , I'm learning new things every day.
DeletedUser
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I would love to see that adventurers get the dodges they make when they ghost. ATM advent sucks hard at getting boxes and I would love to see that change as Im an advent
I would love to see that adventurers get the dodges they make when they ghost. ATM advent sucks hard at getting boxes and I would love to see that change as Im an advent
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DeletedUser20647
yeah, I mean, that would only give them 2-3 extra dodges each battle, right?