GM Event - Capture the Flag (World Dakota only) - DISCUSSION

DeletedUser

And two more questions:

1) Removing the duel protection is for both sides, right? I mean: Can players out of CTF event initiate duels against players inside the event regardless of the duelling level? Or the minimum amount of exp is still limit the number of potential targets for our friends outside the event?

2) What about 48 hours duel protection? If a player out side the event get K.O. can he initiate duel against participants in the event or he has to wait for 48 hours?

And another suggestion: Can we see the stations different from other towns on mini map? Like forts or quest givers? Maybe in next runs you can have even a model different from towns for those.
 
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DeletedUser8627

And two more questions:

1) Removing the duel protection is for both sides, right? I mean: Can players out of CTF event initiate duels against players inside the event regardless of the duelling level? Or the minimum amount of exp is still limit the number of potential targets for our friends outside the event?

Anyone in the world can attack any of the event players, regardless of level or duelling level. This is encouraged because we don't want it easy for you to get points :p But the removal of the duel protection is only for CTF players. You are able to attack a non event player, it's not against the rules (Yes I will still change my announcement) but you will lose five points per duel against an outside player - there is a penalty attached plus you cannot duel anyone you want, the duelling level will count for you. The reason for this change is because I can imagine that you are going to have strong duellers on your back. If someone is giving you hassles, you can KO them, they will have KO protection then and will stop bothering you. Losing 5 or 10 points is a little better than a flag hunter not coming home with a bandannas costing your team 57.6 points. That of course is for a flag hunter going through all 14 stations and returning home.

2) What about 48 hours duel protection? If a player out side the event get K.O. can he initiate duel against participants in the event or he has to wait for 48 hours?

And another suggestion: Can we see the stations different from other towns on mini map? Like forts or quest givers? Maybe in next runs you can have even a model different from towns for those.

No, players outside the event, if they are KOed, they cannot initiate a duel for 48 hours.

As for the suggestion, not possible at the moment. This event is still a work in progress and before I put any more time or effort into this event, I would like to see how the trial goes.
 

DeletedUser26412

This event is still a work in progress and before I put any more time or effort into this event, I would like to see how the trial goes.

i want to start by saying thank you. i had loads of fun last night and played for over 4 hrs none stop. there are things that need fixing or changing but dont change too much its really fun.


# i didnt like the idea of having an advantage by owning county, its should be same so they can be retaken and taken over and over. keep it simple, if you make it too complex it wont work or be as much fun.

## the rules must be explained better, i.e. when updates take place ext. i found it confusing at first when nothing seemed to happen after dueling chinese but now i understand i like it.

### do you think the flag stations would be better as "quest giver" locations than towns?
you would get two choices at the station: DUEL or FLAG.
- pick DUEL and you duel the Chinese player (btw they need to be a bit harder to duel!). win 6 duels to win the county. i like the way you change the colour of clothes so would be nice to keep that somehow. (also can i ask when you ko Chinese how long are they out for?)
- pick flag and you get choice RED or BLUE then move to next station as is now.


Thanks again for the fun,
MRM
 

DeletedUser

I agree with you MRM on majority of your last comment. But I still like to have territory. If you win a country you get some advantage like visibility of opponent which is not that big.

If there be more restriction in which country you can conquer it will be much more fun and harder for duellers. I still best change is to limit the territories to be connected to each other from West/East or North/South. Every team duellers have to start from their HomeBase Country and conquer countries one after another. This force the duellers to clash each other at some point. But as you get closer to your enemy base conquering those country should become harder for your team and easier for the opponent to get it back.

Totally agree about Chinese NPS be harder to duel. I do not like the idea of enabling all players to have a chance to win the duel vs them. But if you make it hard to ordinary players to duel Chinese it will be fair to set a rule to ban the duellers to carry flags. In this case it will be handful to determine who is runner and who is dueller in each team so you know who to hit and who to avoid in each station.

It was fun and it will be. If this continues more active players gonna join the event and it will be much more competitive.

And here are some of my suggestion for the upcoming changes:

If it's possible that Chinese change gear right after the duel that will be great help and make it more fun. This motivate each team for more team work and you would know more about how good other team duellers are doing which will motivate you to do better.

Also if score of each team can be updated in each 8 hour and opponent(s) know it too it will really boosts each team's effort specially if the difference not be that much.
 

DeletedUser8627

Thank you very much for the feedback, I do appreciate it and I would urge you ask your team mates to come and post here as well. The more feedback I can get in, the better the final model will be built.

I've noted your points so far, I'll respond shortly.
 

Snr Sarg

Well-Known Member
Totally agree about Chinese NPS be harder to duel. I do not like the idea of enabling all players to have a chance to win the duel vs them. But if you make it hard to ordinary players to duel Chinese it will be fair to set a rule to ban the duellers to carry flags. In this case it will be handful to determine who is runner and who is dueller in each team so you know who to hit and who to avoid in each station.

I disagree with this, might be easier for a pure dueler, but the event needs to be open and attractive to all levels who might not find them so easy to beat. I propose keeping the Chinese skill levels about the same, but perhaps give them MUCH more HP so they don't get KOed so easily.

If it's possible that Chinese change gear right after the duel that will be great help and make it more fun. This motivate each team for more team work and you would know more about how good other team duellers are doing which will motivate you to do better.

Also if score of each team can be updated in each 8 hour and opponent(s) know it too it will really boosts each team's effort specially if the difference not be that much.

Agreed. At times we were waiting for what seemed like several hours for Chinese to change clothing to one colour or another, it needs to be immediate.

For the scoring, is there any way to automate it to give a running live score at all times?
 

DeletedUser

I disagree with this, might be easier for a pure dueler, but the event needs to be open and attractive to all levels who might not find them so easy to beat. I propose keeping the Chinese skill levels about the same, but perhaps give them MUCH more HP so they don't get KOed so easily.

First of all, having different role in the event means different type of people should get in. If ordinary people can beat Chinese then you are actually telling pure duellers that they can bring the same to the team as a non-skilled player in duelling.

Making Chinese harder to beat does not mean players without duelling skills can not get in the event, this means that they should play another role rather than duelling which is fair because of their skill build.

If conquering the countries be limited to connected countries as this will force duellers to face each other and fight to conquer specific countries then each team prefer to have pure duellers in that role.
 

Nisa

Well-Known Member
Im still not sure what to think about making Chinese harder but I will go with Snr for now.

I would say it should depend on how long event lasts and how many ppl we have in teams and how many teams will participate.

Let's say event lasts 1 day and teams have 20 players. Out of 20, 5-6 are real duelers and you need 6 wins to change NPC clothes and capture the station. We can assume players from both ( or more teams ) are at same station winning and losing vs harder Chinese so it could take too long until 1 team 'wins' taking only real duelers can win against them.
It's more fun if average and lowers duelers have a chance to win too and score points.

I dont know about you but I lost quite a few duels against chinese :p

If event lasts longer and more players are involved then maybe yes.
 

DeletedUser33051

Hello

It would be very cool to have a score card that opened at the end of the event showing individual score and team score. Just like we have in the fort battles.
 

DeletedUser26412

# no im not saying make the Chinese that hard that only duelers can hit them. just a bit harder, i never lost one duel to them, it was a free win every time and became very repetative. maybe we need to see more Chinese roaming round hitting both sides too.

## sorry Dash i still dont like the idea of connecting territories or giving advantages.
having a free for all makes people think about tactics and try to out smart each other, thats why the sides are even to start with.

### ok this bit is for Da Twista only please! i dont want any more arguments or discussions with my team mates :D
in the last hour of the game i decided to try running a flag but it seemed to go wrong. i went to station 8 (our first station) payed $14 for a blue bandana but didnt get one "quiet Dash" :p. i got a report telling me to pick it up at another station.
now my question is, is this a glitch or part of Chinese spoiling tactics?
i know how to use the market and im 100% sure i didn't get a blue bandana at station 8 i tried twice then gave up.
[report=91395357f37b5f036d]Immediate purchase of (1) Blue bandana [/report]
[report=91395459e9890c6566]Immediate purchase of (1) Blue bandana [/report]

thank you for your time
MRM

Hello

It would be very cool to have a score card that opened at the end of the event showing individual score and team score. Just like we have in the fort battles.


yes i like this idea and achievements too
 
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DeletedUser8627

i want to start by saying thank you. i had loads of fun last night and played for over 4 hrs none stop. there are things that need fixing or changing but dont change too much its really fun.


# i didnt like the idea of having an advantage by owning county, its should be same so they can be retaken and taken over and over. keep it simple, if you make it too complex it wont work or be as much fun.

## the rules must be explained better, i.e. when updates take place ext. i found it confusing at first when nothing seemed to happen after dueling chinese but now i understand i like it.

### do you think the flag stations would be better as "quest giver" locations than towns?
you would get two choices at the station: DUEL or FLAG.
- pick DUEL and you duel the Chinese player (btw they need to be a bit harder to duel!). win 6 duels to win the county. i like the way you change the colour of clothes so would be nice to keep that somehow. (also can i ask when you ko Chinese how long are they out for?)
- pick flag and you get choice RED or BLUE then move to next station as is now.


Thanks again for the fun,
MRM

Hi MRM,

If a county has been taken i.e. win 6 duels in sequence to turn the GM clothing color to match your team, the county belongs to your team. However, if your opponent has 6 duels wins in sequence, they can take that county from you.

Some of the rules did change, and my fault for not making participants aware of these changes. But this was only a test run, everything is bound to change. But of course, with the final release, there will be a proper set of rules and guidelines available. For the testing purpose, it was to see how it would work rather than just making it work.

As for your third point, not impossible because a GM event is a temporary feature run solely on one language server and not across all language servers. Because of this, we will not be able to make actual quest givers but I do have a trick up my sleeve to achieve something similar.

If it's possible that Chinese change gear right after the duel that will be great help and make it more fun. This motivate each team for more team work and you would know more about how good other team duellers are doing which will motivate you to do better.
It is possible but we only had three people behind all the characters. The workload is tremendous at the moment having to keep tabs on everything happening.
Changes to the event that will be made will be a smaller playing area rather than using the whole map plus reducing the number of stations to visit.
The idea here is to reduce the vast spaces between players so there is also interaction between them rather than having a marathon around the map. The purpose of allowing players to duel whomever they wanted was in fact to have them have mini wars against each other. But the map was too big to get this right.
Other than that, Chinese players received many duels. They will be made a lot stronger so that only an experience dueller will be able to atually beat them while other team members concentrate on other aspects of the event.

Also if score of each team can be updated in each 8 hour and opponent(s) know it too it will really boosts each team's effort specially if the difference not be that much.
In the actual event, this will be displayed. I was planning to display them for the test, but having the test only running for a 24 hour period seemed pretty much pointless.

I disagree with this, might be easier for a pure dueler, but the event needs to be open and attractive to all levels who might not find them so easy to beat. I propose keeping the Chinese skill levels about the same, but perhaps give them MUCH more HP so they don't get KOed so easily.
If the Chinese are too weak, you can duel them every 10 minutes and ultimately KO them in about 4 duels. Not ideal especially if you have two teams trying to gain the same county. Having a stronger opponant is a better choice for us to stop too many duels hitting a chinese at a time. Not that there is anything wrong with it, just helps us not changing county ownership every 5 minutes.

It would be very cool to have a score card that opened at the end of the event showing individual score and team score. Just like we have in the fort battles.
It's a plan so far. We do have a detailed scoring system we used to calculate each teams score. This will be annouced at the end of each event along with the prizes

ok this bit is for Da Twista only please! i dont want any more arguments or discussions with my team mates
I haven't looked at your market logs, due to the amount of trades that did happen in the last 24 hours it's going to be too much of a mission to find. We didn't change anything or do anything, if you did indeed purchase it from the correct station, it will be there at that station for you to pick up. Something that was mentioned by one of the teams was to confuse the other by also placing bandanas up on the market. Of course buying the wrong bandana wouldn't yield any points.

yes i like this idea and achievements too

Achievements would be nice to have, but this is a temporary event run on one server. No development time to create new content or features will be allocated. Well not so much as content as we did get the fortune cookie made, but that's an item and not an actual entry into a player's profile.

-------------------------------------------------

It was fun from our side too, it was a lot of work, I stayed up for us sorting out player and chinese accounts. It is a tremendous amount of work to run something like this so your patience will be appreciated. When the next event runs, we will have a lot more hands helping out.

I do thank you for the feedback thus far, keep it coming in.

For now, there is no set date for the next event, we will when we run the next one, take the test players for yet another test run. Those whom didn't bother will not be considered and replaced with players that couldn't get in due to number limits.

For now, we are reworking a few things, our main goals are to get majority of players into the same area for more interaction, make flag collecting harder and we will be increasing the Chinese strength.

P.S. Excuse any spelling errors in this post, I'm exhausted and need some sleep :unsure:
 

DeletedUser26412

Hi MRM,



I haven't looked at your market logs, due to the amount of trades that did happen in the last 24 hours it's going to be too much of a mission to find. We didn't change anything or do anything, if you did indeed purchase it from the correct station, it will be there at that station for you to pick up. Something that was mentioned by one of the teams was to confuse the other by also placing bandanas up on the market. Of course buying the wrong bandana wouldn't yield any points.

im glad you guys had fun too and appreciate all the hard work you put in and same goes to Chloe and Nisa.

as for the bandana, i bought two in the last hr of the game at the right station from two diffrent chinese players and didnt get either one! so i think some thing went wrong.
Chole O Gurl "capt red seemed to have a problem too"
i wanted to try flag running, oh well maybe next time ;)

ok i think i see what i did wrong with the bandanas, i went to station 8 and tried to buy them but bought them form other stations i guess. this was my first flag buy and didnt check location when i was buying. Damn my fault! (but its not a good way to list them i think).

Da Twista,
if your going to change the map size to bunch players up more try to keep the distance between flags the same. 20-30 min is about right i think, any longer is boring and any shorter makes it too hard for duelers to catch the runners.

MRM

ok a few people have asked me why i wanted to change the stations from towns.
- on the plus side yes towns are easy to find on the map.
- on the down side i thought buying flags off the market was a bit messy (even without the trouble i had). i think getting a simple choice of DUEL (chinese player) or FLAG at each station would look good.

also and this is my main reason, as the game went on the flag stations got hotels! this makes it impossible for duelers. the runners could move from sleep to sleep.
 
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foscock

Well-Known Member
Thanks very much to Twista and the others behind the scenes for putting this event on, I had a blast, even called in sick to be online longer :)

Chinese dueling skills: I think it should stay close to what it is at the moment. I know quite a few of our non-duelers enjoyed the opportunity to do some dueling. And there was nothing stopping the real duelers from lowering the damage they caused by using a weapon like a slingshot - that adds a bit of risk to the dueler, but it also added to the excitement.

Smaller playing field: I agree it should be smaller. I suggest leaving the home bases where they are, and have 6-8 stations in counties 3-5 & 10-12. That way the trip back to home base is a longer one and provides opportunities for mayhem :)

Event duration: I think 1 or 2 days should be the max, the intensity of this shorter event was what made it so fun.

Thanks again, look forward to the next one.

EDIT: Nisa would like to see a new quest that requires 100's of red bandanas!
 
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DeletedUser8627

as for the bandana, i bought two in the last hr of the game at the right station from two diffrent chinese players and didnt get either one! so i think some thing went wrong.
Not wrong from our side, we shall call it player fault :p

You bought one bandana from Fan Rui which is based in station 4 and one from Meng Kang based in station 6. If you were at station 8, you should have bought from the station 8 Chinese NPC.

- on the down side i thought buying flags off the market was a bit messy (even without the trouble i had). i think getting a simple choice of DUEL (chinese player) or FLAG at each station would look good.
Well we just wanted to see how well it would go and if players would be able to pick up flags. It went well and some managed to lap the map 4 times if I recall correctly. But as I said earlier, I would like flag hunting to be difficult. So instead of having bandana purchases, we are entertaining ideas where you have to solve a riddle to get an idea what item is actually needed on purchase. But of course there are a few kinks in this method. So we still looking into it.

Smaller playing field: I agree it should be smaller. I suggest leaving the home bases where they are, and have 6-8 stations in counties 3-5 & 10-12. That way the trip back to home base is a longer one and provides opportunities for mayhem
We're looking at probably 6 counties, basically half the map only. We only ran two teams in this event while we initially designed it for four teams.

If you take a look at the map I posted http://forum.the-west.net/showthread.php?t=53622.

1, 3, 12 and 14 being homebase counties, 1 - 4 and 12 - 14 having stations in them. The next event we'll try four teams, half the map and stations for a bloodbath. Seems like fun.
 

DeletedUser

We're looking at probably 6 counties, basically half the map only.

1, 3, 12 and 14 being homebase counties, 1 - 4 and 12 - 14 having stations in them. The next event we'll try four teams, half the map and stations for a bloodbath. Seems like fun.

6 countries are fine but why on the West side of the map? Isn't it more convenient to use the countries in the center? Say 3-4-5 and 10-11-12 from your map.

Like this players that are not participate in the event are more likely willing to duel the teams and it's more fair for duellers that have their home town on east part of the world.
 
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DeletedUser33797

First i want to thank you all players and devs alike for the fun we have in this event.
As for making chinese harder i will say let them as it is cause they are already hard to defeat for a non dueler guy like me.I only dueled 2 Chinese NPC`s with hints on where to dodge and shot and i was like a sitting duck for him :). The only problem i had during the event it`s that none of the natives where after me:).
I got hit only 3 times one as a revenge hit an 2 after a little chat in the CTF chat :). Probably the main focus of the duelers was to get a station .Maybe getting a few more point for dueling other players will make it more challenging for both sides.
Good stuff anyway looking forward to the next one ;)
 

DeletedUser

bigger teams, and max 2 days like fos said. but still atm it leans towards being a very duellish event, also a very level 120 event below level 70-80 once those top dogs duel you, your bound to be ko'd (poor goldie!) but dunno am not sure what to think of it, current version we tested was to boring at start i thought i should run and sleep 10 mins.. after that i didn't bothered to hotelize myself anymore in 3 laps i got duelled twice only
 

DeletedUser26412

as I said earlier, I would like flag hunting to be difficult. So instead of having bandana purchases, we are entertaining ideas where you have to solve a riddle to get an idea what item is actually needed on purchase. But of course there are a few kinks in this method. So we still looking into it.


i can see how this would be fun for the flag runners. i remember a few years back a chocolate company here held an Easter egg hunt. the clues were in a book and you had to travel around the country to find real Faberge eggs the clues were very hard as the prizes were worth a lot of money.
anyway back to our game you could ask questions about the game its self. basing questions on questing, crafting, fort building ext.

this might help the duelers too by slowing the runners down while they workout the clues.

i would also like to see random duels from the Chinese, players like Li Jun and Li Kui set up to duel for real! they could roam around hitting both sides at random.

bigger teams, and max 2 days like fos said. but still atm it leans towards being a very duellish event, also a very level 120 event below level 70-80 once those top dogs duel you, your bound to be ko'd (poor goldie!) but dunno am not sure what to think of it, current version we tested was to boring at start i thought i should run and sleep 10 mins.. after that i didn't bothered to hotelize myself anymore in 3 laps i got duelled twice only

i think the times should very some 1 day or 2 day and some for a week. the 1-2 day event should be held at the w/e too so people can put the time in without phoning in sick from work/school lol.

yes this game is fun for duelers and about time too. the west in the last few years has become all about FF, too much so in my opinion. dont get me wrong i like to FF but the west has so much more to offer and a lot of that has been lost in recent times!

as you said it is still hard for duelers to catch the runners and even harder to KO them (especially the tanks) just like in the main game!! so i dont believe non-duelers are at a disadvantage.
maybe your right about the levels and some events could be held for people under L70 or something.

overall tho im very happy with CTF so far and hope its not too temporary, it could work as a stand alone game nm a sub-game within the west.

The only problem i had during the event it`s that none of the natives where after me:).
I got hit only 3 times one as a revenge hit an 2 after a little chat in the CTF chat :). Probably the main focus of the duelers was to get a station .Maybe getting a few more point for dueling other players will make it more challenging for both sides.
Good stuff anyway looking forward to the next one ;)

at the start we were expecting the event to be over 3 days. we had a number of tactics to try but when the event finished after only 1 day we had to leave them.. for now!

pts for dueling player is a good idea for me as im a dueler haha but i dont know how the non-duelers would feel about this.
duelers have the same problem in CTF as they do in the main game, maybe more so as its faster moving in CTF. its hard to KO FFing tanks, i hope to talk to Da Twista at some point about this and other things i think might improve the main game.

6 countries are fine but why on the West side of the map? Isn't it more convenient to use the countries in the center? Say 3-4-5 and 10-11-12 from your map.


i agree, if we are changing the map use the center: 3, 4, 5, and 10, 11, 12 and keep the home bases where they are in 1, 7, 8, and 14 making flag runners risk a long run home. the final station for each team might become the killing zones you are looking for.
also by using the center it lets the Chinese players pop in and out of all six location from the Chinese area in the middle to duel all the teams.





# im sorry to hear the GM event is ending on w11, unlike most the FFers i like the Chinese guys lol. i would especially like to thank Chao Gai & Li Jun (tho i must say your brother Li Kui is a yellow chicken) i had fun ff & dueling & most of all playing CTF, i hope CTF can remain part of w11 some how after you leave? you cant take that away after such a short time! PLEASE :)
MRM
 
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DeletedUser35246

Event duration: I think 1 or 2 days should be the max, the intensity of this shorter event was what made it so fun. (Foscock Quote)
I had fun with the event CTF, but agree with above quote to keep it short, it does increase the intensity
Mistress Monica
 
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