DeletedUser
Sorry, but i don't see how it will bring more player to world 11 and 12. I just don't see it. :whistle:
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Sorry, but i don't see how it will bring more player to world 11 and 12. I just don't see it. :whistle:
Deleted User - 1278415
If I can interject... I think when hellstromm made that comment it might have been tongue in cheek, sarcasm, meaning the opposite of Popular demand of the users. and the 1 angry badger was Hellstromm fighting for the popular choice of the vocal players on the forum.
Now if could be popular demand of the developers and maybe not clientele of the product. servers + bandwidth do cost money. The Devs... have seen that w13 and w14 have had a higher player retention rate that other worlds have lost out on.
If you invest money into a character your possibly less likely to say eh... its a free character... but no you invested money into the character now and you will probably want to stick around longer to see the character story turns out.
DeletedUser
Very true.. investing money into something makes it more of a personal value for you and will become a bigger priority.
But you are missing my point, NOBODY wants this. So, why would anyone invest some money into their characters? The point is.. maybe 1% of all people will actually go through and pay $$ for a little game like this, and then never leave.. whereas the majority will just leave altogether. Which is better?
Seriously, if it is about money throw some ads on the side for all I care.
DeletedUser21320
I think point 1 is spot on.
But this is not about money. If it were, they would open world 15. The bandwidth argument has always been BS. Compared to the cost of even one programmer, or the office rent, bandwidth is a non-issue.
And W13 & 14 have not been around long enough to show the drop-off that the old worlds have had after months and years of play. Give the new, accelerated worlds a couple of months, and players will be flocking to the next great...
But the players have invested something far more valuable than money into their characters already - massive amounts of time and, in some cases, imagination. If the game were fun and fair, people would willingly pay money to play. I play in two other games that each cost me more than I would spend on TW.
This latest NON-requested change is just an arrogant attempt to force everyone to pay and play one way, and to close the old worlds. If it were any other reason, why would the devs have closed world 1 FIRST? By most accounts, it was the most active of the old worlds, probably followed by 11 and 12.
Greed kills.
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DeletedUser
I think your point that world 13 & 14 have not been around long enough to be able to say they have outlasted other worlds is very valid. Also world 13 & 14 didn't have other new worlds started really quickly really world 12 didn't stand a chance nor did 11 you started another world so quickly that peeps didn't get established on the worlds so was easy to move off to a new one. Time is what people invest and stick with a bit of cash here and there wont make people stay you stay on a world cos of the time you invest in it and the people who play it with you so your really stuffing the worlds before they get a chance by imp new worlds constantly. It's interesting that you wont be doing that to the full premium pay worlds as obviously you want people to stay there.............................
DeletedUser
They won't they'll just close the game down, if no-one buys premium they make no money.
DeletedUser
Keep the old worlds clean (from 1 to 12).If you want to make money that way,start another world with all new Full premium add-on.Making changes in active worlds such as 11 and 12 won`t make the incomes higher,Ok maybe in the beginning.But when people realize that all their time is lost they will start leaving.
Example:
1.What will happen if someone have a dueler around 70-80 level and one day someone KOs him by a dueler 50-60 levels under just because he buys skills and attributes.First he will try to resist but seriously will quit in a week or two!
2.What will happen if there is a group of players conquesting for the ranking and Hall of Fame.There would be some other people who will try that of course.And one day from nowhere come other who dont sleep cuz they use the new premiums or buys skills for doing better jobs.What will those real players do?! Again they will try to resist and reach the new ones and again will quit their goal.
There are more examples but i refuse to continue just because i become angrier with every other word i write.Creating such a thing is a madness caused by GREED! SHAME ON YOU GUYS!!!, you have created such a good browser game,why are you trying to destroy it now?!
Example:
1.What will happen if someone have a dueler around 70-80 level and one day someone KOs him by a dueler 50-60 levels under just because he buys skills and attributes.First he will try to resist but seriously will quit in a week or two!
2.What will happen if there is a group of players conquesting for the ranking and Hall of Fame.There would be some other people who will try that of course.And one day from nowhere come other who dont sleep cuz they use the new premiums or buys skills for doing better jobs.What will those real players do?! Again they will try to resist and reach the new ones and again will quit their goal.
There are more examples but i refuse to continue just because i become angrier with every other word i write.Creating such a thing is a madness caused by GREED! SHAME ON YOU GUYS!!!, you have created such a good browser game,why are you trying to destroy it now?!
DeletedUser
Balanced in favor of those that use them? I have no interest in purchasing skill points through premium, it destroys the integrity of the game. I had a look on one of the new Worlds, someone level 38 had 80 AP in dexterity, clearly that player had bottomless pockets. Unaffordable? Obviously not for everyone. Fair? Clearly not!
W11 has been around long enough to have 4 level 99 players, I'd say it is very well established myself.
Why don't they open up World's with different settings, like Tribal Wars does. W15 for example being 'Classic', with 2 hour jobs and none of these new premium features, I'm sure it would be very popular with the established players who I would suggest would be happy to pay premium for extra energy, income bonus, char bonus & automation.
W16 being 'Full' with 1 hour jobs and these new features, anyone who wants a new mortgage to compete can play this.
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DeletedUser23701
guys, what the point to argue!?
tbh it looks more like arguing between each other than with Inno representatives.
I know that it's hard to just simply press delete after years of developing your perfect account. Or stop using premium at all and make less profit for Inno from you personally.
Maybe they'll close older worlds as those gives no profit, who knows.
Nothing personal, just business, take it or leave it.
tbh it looks more like arguing between each other than with Inno representatives.
I know that it's hard to just simply press delete after years of developing your perfect account. Or stop using premium at all and make less profit for Inno from you personally.
Maybe they'll close older worlds as those gives no profit, who knows.
Nothing personal, just business, take it or leave it.
DeletedUser
Really Hells? Man, I do respect you all, but you obviously don't read the whole forum.
For example, let's see what does this Arizona soldier say:
http://forum.the-west.net/showpost.php?p=492117&postcount=6
Combine this with energy refill, then with solving quests for more AP/SP and shaman to respec... How come? Easy! You have more SP and AP than others so you can solve those quests weeks before others do!
And now that Arizona soldier has billions of HP in fort fights. Months before players could even dream about a HP build.
Don't get me wrong here, I don't blame the player - he has the money, he has options, why wouldn't he use them?
But it feels like I'm saying this: Who cares if slavery is unethical if you have the money to buy slaves, right?
Of course it's not right!
And you say the game is balanced with skillbuying. Yea, right. I'll spit on the skillbuying crap till the rest of my life. Ok, till I quit the game. As it looks now, it will be pretty soon.
Trully I have nothing against other new premiums. I can live with all of them. But this one is ruining the game.
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Deleted User - 1693871
Quoted for truth. The skills and attribute buying is the one premium that completely skews the playing field. :censored:
DeletedUser
this is just plain wrong a lot of people have spent time and money (normal premium) on making worlds 11 and 12 what they are now which is fun interesting and friendly
and in some of the most recent updates inno stated there was "TOO MUCH MONEY IN THE GAME AND THEY WERE LOOKING TO TAKE SOME OUT OF IT" well by putting 11 and 12 on full premmy then i see the opposite happening
1)buy energy work more jobs earn more cash
2)buy SP an AP work more jobs sooner again more cash
3)placate shaman (reset costs) "oh look i wont spend 200k respeccing i will only spend 100k leaving me 100k to spend on stuff"
come on get real if you want more full premium worlds then bring out 2 more dont damage the support already in place
DeletedUser
I'm puzzled as to why a poll was requested. The West's server data and financial records will have far more concrete statistics than any poll would generate. You know, there is also that niggly thing of people saying one thing to fit in or go along with the "crowd" but in actuality believing in something else altogether, which is bound to be a near guarantee in a public poll. But would you trust a private poll? And if one were to set a bar on who can or cannot vote, there's a good chance of valid participants getting locked out. Which would render the poll useless. How accurate can it be if opinions are cherry-picked or if people are unable to say how they truly feel?
At the heart of the issue, there is really nothing unfair at all about the ability to purchase skill or attribute points. While it's rewarding to build your character from the ground up without using any of these, we have to remember we don't have the right to impose our playing mannerisms or morals on anyone else. It might come as a surprise, but not everyone is interested in ranking supreme, upstaging other players or being the best dueler in an entire world. A couple, like myself simply prefer questing and unlocking jobs to the fullest extent possible. This premium feature might come in handy for anyone who just wishes to accomplish things a wee tad faster.
As far as I know, no one is forced to fork out money for these. This game is meant to be enjoyed by as many possible within the framework set out by the creators. If another group of people feel more excitable at the prospect of leveling through the purchase of points, it's their right. Everyone else can just simply go on about their business and ignore them.
Earlier, I was foolish enough to have not read through the announcing post fully but have duly rectified that mistake. Here's a breakdown of the purchase cost for ex. Two skill points - the first point comes at a cost of 18 nuggets, subsequent points are multiplied by 2 then 3 and so on and forth. Hence two points will cost 54 nuggets in total. It isn't as cheap as people think it is. Don't say silly things like "Player X/Y has more 4 bought skill points!" 4 skill points isn't an incredibly huge advantage and it will cost the player about 200+/- nuggets. Enough to purchase a cheap sandwich.
To beat out other players on a professional level, one should need about 50-100 skill points as a start. 50 skill points would cost 22950 nuggets and that would be approximately 456.71 Euros. Realistically, how many people here would seriously splash out this much on a casual browser game and not the feel the pinch? Especially if majority of the players on the worlds are non-payers as most folks on this thread seem to be.
The penalty for the skill point charge is certainly nonconstructive. In a business sense, there is a huge potential to earn a bagful of profits from people who'd purchase skill points. Not everyone is interested in manual slogging. Understandably so, a game is for entertainment and relaxation. Slogging is reserved for your nine to five real world job. But, only if the cost justifies the rewards. At this rate, you can't buy many skill points enough without taking out a mighty slab of money to be at a decent skill level to embark on difficult quests or to achieve any sort of personal goal. This crowd might call it quits early or simply be a non-payer like everyone else. Also, Innogames is obviously pissing everyone else off at the same time.
It's like cutting off your profit strings before you even begin. If skill points are priced decently, they'd be bought by the bagful. Far more cash earned in conjuction with those who only buy higher wages or automation where purchases are only necessary after a stipulated duration. On top of that, this gratified crowd might seek out higher wages or automation as well.
To wrap it all up, there is really a lot more to premium than the buying of stat points. A lot of nice these things have been introduced. Like a store for yourself, extra class benefits for fort battles, the ability to not have to pay banking fees as money isn't easy to come by. Less time taken for a job and a clear showing of how much you could earn. It's not that bad, in my opinion.
At the heart of the issue, there is really nothing unfair at all about the ability to purchase skill or attribute points. While it's rewarding to build your character from the ground up without using any of these, we have to remember we don't have the right to impose our playing mannerisms or morals on anyone else. It might come as a surprise, but not everyone is interested in ranking supreme, upstaging other players or being the best dueler in an entire world. A couple, like myself simply prefer questing and unlocking jobs to the fullest extent possible. This premium feature might come in handy for anyone who just wishes to accomplish things a wee tad faster.
As far as I know, no one is forced to fork out money for these. This game is meant to be enjoyed by as many possible within the framework set out by the creators. If another group of people feel more excitable at the prospect of leveling through the purchase of points, it's their right. Everyone else can just simply go on about their business and ignore them.
Earlier, I was foolish enough to have not read through the announcing post fully but have duly rectified that mistake. Here's a breakdown of the purchase cost for ex. Two skill points - the first point comes at a cost of 18 nuggets, subsequent points are multiplied by 2 then 3 and so on and forth. Hence two points will cost 54 nuggets in total. It isn't as cheap as people think it is. Don't say silly things like "Player X/Y has more 4 bought skill points!" 4 skill points isn't an incredibly huge advantage and it will cost the player about 200+/- nuggets. Enough to purchase a cheap sandwich.
To beat out other players on a professional level, one should need about 50-100 skill points as a start. 50 skill points would cost 22950 nuggets and that would be approximately 456.71 Euros. Realistically, how many people here would seriously splash out this much on a casual browser game and not the feel the pinch? Especially if majority of the players on the worlds are non-payers as most folks on this thread seem to be.
The penalty for the skill point charge is certainly nonconstructive. In a business sense, there is a huge potential to earn a bagful of profits from people who'd purchase skill points. Not everyone is interested in manual slogging. Understandably so, a game is for entertainment and relaxation. Slogging is reserved for your nine to five real world job. But, only if the cost justifies the rewards. At this rate, you can't buy many skill points enough without taking out a mighty slab of money to be at a decent skill level to embark on difficult quests or to achieve any sort of personal goal. This crowd might call it quits early or simply be a non-payer like everyone else. Also, Innogames is obviously pissing everyone else off at the same time.
It's like cutting off your profit strings before you even begin. If skill points are priced decently, they'd be bought by the bagful. Far more cash earned in conjuction with those who only buy higher wages or automation where purchases are only necessary after a stipulated duration. On top of that, this gratified crowd might seek out higher wages or automation as well.
To wrap it all up, there is really a lot more to premium than the buying of stat points. A lot of nice these things have been introduced. Like a store for yourself, extra class benefits for fort battles, the ability to not have to pay banking fees as money isn't easy to come by. Less time taken for a job and a clear showing of how much you could earn. It's not that bad, in my opinion.
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DeletedUser23701
omg, what it is?
professional skill buying level?
I've saw some players who had like 10 AP and 20 SP at lvl 1 on briscoe.
Well, they are well behind me just because it gave only short term advantage.
But yes, in hands of experienced player even few extra AP/SP gives benefits.
For 1h worlds the energy refill gives bigger disbalance and faster leveling than extra AP/SP.
DeletedUser
Is it just me but there is always the same old arguments going round on here. Seeing as the purchase of attributes/skill argument keeps cropping up, how many players have actually come into contact with one of these super specced players on any world??? Even on beta where all these premiums can be purchased (at a discount) I have yet to see these super soldiers. Sure I have bought premium (on .net) on and off since the game started, on all of the available packages to my knowledge. But even so I feel that it is rare for people to spend the sums of money in excess of a few hundred, to become a real threat to other players. And those that do exist get bored and move on very quickly. Also don't you feel, richer gamers would spend their money playing more demanding games, with dedicated gaming rigs???? All I see is a lot of fear mongering, which is easy to get carried away with.
DeletedUser
This is the worst statement I've ever seen. I dare to say it's blasphemic.
I bet you've never played with skills/jobs and reskill. It only takes a few bought skill points combined with the rediculously cheap shaman feature to give you an enormous advantage. Not only that, even when other players finally get on your level and solve everything they wanted to solve, you will still have the skill advantage they can never get. Did you read this last part? Let me repeat it:
when other players finally get on your level and solve everything they wanted to solve, you will still have the skill advantage they can never get
You don't believe me? I can make you a walkhrough on this for god sake. You don't even have to be rich to do it, just get yourself a few packets of 1000 nuggets and in less than 2 months you'll have all AP/SP available from quests + in the end you'll have a build you wanted, it's only your choice if that would be alljobs, dueling or fort fighter build, and as I've said above, when all other players after a few months finally reach their goal whatever that might be, your build will still be untouchable by those who haven't bought skills. Why? Because for some crap reason I will never understand - nuggetskills are PERMANENT.
Sorry but we're not talking about beta testing and beta character builds.
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DeletedUser
in response to CHERIO it is not the full premium thing most of us are against i think you have missed the real issue here and that is they are suddenly bringing it in to 2 (W11 & W12 ) existing OLD worlds even HELLSTOMMM admitted they were old worlds by stating and i quote "NEWER OLD WORLDS"
i have no objection to full premium worlds i do however object to the huge unbalancing of exisiting worlds i have played on the new worlds (non premium player)
leave the existing worlds with the standard premium they have now and bring in other SPEED/FULL PREMIUM worlds if need be
the latest rounds of updates have brought in new features for us all and ppl are still working out the pros and cons of them as it is
to INNO i say this STOP AND THINK GUYS/GIRLS you currently have 12 worlds of players who enjoy playing The West as it is and i already know of a lot of very established and familiar names that are talking of going elsewhere
i am not saying your greedy thats wrong i just think your caught up a little in the big buck fast return cycle without looking further down the line at the potential for diminishing returns from that
by all means let us have full premium worlds but let them run alongside the existing worlds rather than trample all over them i think your idea for speed/full premium is a potentialy good one just i really think that your execution of it is a little shortsighted
thats my tuppence worth anyways
i have no objection to full premium worlds i do however object to the huge unbalancing of exisiting worlds i have played on the new worlds (non premium player)
leave the existing worlds with the standard premium they have now and bring in other SPEED/FULL PREMIUM worlds if need be
the latest rounds of updates have brought in new features for us all and ppl are still working out the pros and cons of them as it is
to INNO i say this STOP AND THINK GUYS/GIRLS you currently have 12 worlds of players who enjoy playing The West as it is and i already know of a lot of very established and familiar names that are talking of going elsewhere
i am not saying your greedy thats wrong i just think your caught up a little in the big buck fast return cycle without looking further down the line at the potential for diminishing returns from that
by all means let us have full premium worlds but let them run alongside the existing worlds rather than trample all over them i think your idea for speed/full premium is a potentialy good one just i really think that your execution of it is a little shortsighted
thats my tuppence worth anyways
DeletedUser
Joxer, you're not looking at this correctly. The guy spent a buttload of "non-premium" points on health points. Also, that person's claim of 7360 hps is misleading, in that a a good chunk of those points are coming from the items he's wearing. If you put most or all your points into health, you'll end up with similar results without purchasing attributes/skills. In fact, at level 70 (which is the above-noted character's level), you could effectively have 6400+clothing bonuses, resulting in 8000+ hps (assuming you're a soldier and using the "old" class premium). The impact of new premium features is being grossly exaggerated, it really is.
Anyway, look people --- we had a choice of adding two new worlds within a month, resulting in further depreciating player numbers in the existing worlds, or including world 11 and 12 into the the new player rotation, and adding full premium to both those worlds.
Ultimately, the call was mine. No action taken would satisfy everyone, and I'm tasked with doing things that are occasionally going to be unpopular. Nonetheless, looking at things from this end, from the information available to us, this is the right thing to do for this community, and Innogames, as a whole. Just one more reason to hate me.
DeletedUser
Ultimately, the call was mine. No action taken would satisfy everyone, and I'm tasked with doing things that are occasionally going to be unpopular. Nonetheless, looking at things from this end, from the information available to us, this is the right thing to do for this community, and Innogames, as a whole. Just one more reason to hate me.
i dont hate you Hell i just think this time (you say it was your call) you got it wrong in a majorly spectacularly lighted match in a firework factory kinda way
more speed worlds while keeping exisiting worlds would have got a big fact YES from me let people play the game their way there is no reason that the to types of world cannot co-exist side by side why and what justification can their be for alienating so many from what many people consider to be the best worlds to play at this time
DeletedUser
Hells, I'm not a soldier on Arizona. I can never have that kind of HP. Never. Unless I buy even more skills than he did. It's obvious you don't believe anything I say, but can you at least believe me that if I buy skills I'll feel like an idiot conned by InnoGames?
Yes, that guy spent buttload of nonpremium SP on health - but got those nonpremium quest reward SP months before anyone else who didn't buy skills. Ok, if that's exaggerated then yes, I'm exaggerating.
And noone hates you. That crap feature was not added to the game by you but by InnoGames. If that feature never existed in the first place, you'd never see me complaining on adding other premiums to old worlds.
Yes, that guy spent buttload of nonpremium SP on health - but got those nonpremium quest reward SP months before anyone else who didn't buy skills. Ok, if that's exaggerated then yes, I'm exaggerating.
And noone hates you. That crap feature was not added to the game by you but by InnoGames. If that feature never existed in the first place, you'd never see me complaining on adding other premiums to old worlds.
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