NSA's Criminal Activity

[DeletedUser529]

No Scamp it really is , for most.... seeing it in black and white or colour backed up by files dates names makes it 100% REAL.

Like wife or child beating in the past everyone knows it used to go on regardless, it wasn't a big deal until people were confronted with the FACTS and exposed in all its gory details and still it goes on right under our noses.

Nobody of any merit or worth high up was prepared to expose this publicly with proof but they know what was going on too, if they did it was career suicide maybe even their life. IMO the ONLY reason snowman is alive today is simply BECAUSE he went high profile and dropping exposure and facts openly as possible. If he'd have gone to his boss or higher he'd already be dead and no one the wiser.

In fact if it wasn't for the alternative media and net I do not believe it would have been allowed mention on the mainstream media at all.

The ONLY time the TPTB sits up and takes note is when it affects THEM, OR when the alternative media takes something viral forcing the mainstream to cover it.

Look around you, make no mistake 99% of people suck up the crap they are fed and will continue to do so or say dumb things like oh he's an idiot for telling the truth and exposing this growing Nazi Stormtrooper mentality. Thats how much people care about their future, thats how helpless people feel and how pointless they consider trying to make a difference is....Cower in the corner be afraid to speak out, whats the point ? that is a BIG mistake for that is EXACTLY what its counting on to continue its ever increasing influence around the globe.

The world is upside down, we have fraudsters being given billions A BS US president who was given the Peace prize for torture, reducing freedoms and sanctioning drone strikes enmasse. People who attempt to tell the truth are hunted and treated like criminals. Children who stupidly hack into Gov non protected system are wanted as terrorists. Even peace demonstrators or advocates are put on the suspected terrorist watch list. Heroes of humanity are called traitors.

You might as well call the NSA the tech and data collecting section of the CIA only it encompasses everyone. The SS would be green with envy the way the NSA have turned NATIONAL SECURITY into a worldwide surveillance system and data gathering of the minutest details.

You want to know the best organised, pervasive and well armed terrorist group on the planet ? Well the NSA is an important part of it.

Well said man.....Obama has made Ex President Bush look good......

 

[DeletedUser529]

Not only is the Obama administration Spying on our Phone calls, Internet useage, but also They collect and catalog our DNA, and our License plate numbers. They attempt to track us in real time with our auto license plate numbers and with facial recognition. As more and more cameras are installed all throughout North America we are being watched more and more....Funny my most favorite show is Person of Interest.......

 

[DeletedUser15038]

IMO the NSA is involved in FAR scarier activities than spying on phone calls. Search battle of the china gates captain mark richards

 

[DeletedUser28545]

"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin.

And I'm sorry, amigo, but that utilitarian argument is tired and sophomoric. 9/11 is no excuse for any government to flaunt the rule of law, especially the United States government. There is no ethical or practical justification for a government that was conceived to protect the life and liberty of its people to systematically lie to, spy on, and tyrannize its own citizens at monstrous cost in the name of "national security". The ends do not justify the means. To claim that it does is to move into the realm of the psychopath.

If the United States government really wanted to do everything in its power to "stop terrorism", then it ought to drastically change its foreign policy (i.e. stop defecating on and stomping on the faces of the rest of the world) and stop terrorizing its own citizens. Americans don't need and shouldn't have a Kafkaesque panopticon corporatist state to "stop terrorism". Far more effective domestic security could be achieved through better diplomacy, customs inspections, and old-fashioned police work, at a fraction of the countless billions currently being spent, and without sacrificing essential liberty.

So much of what governments do to us reminds me of the movie, "Cool Hand Luke". I think especially of the scene where the prison warden, "the Captain", explains to Luke why he is going to be locked up yet again in the sweat box "for [his] own good".

"Cap'n," Luke replies, "I wish you'd stop bein' so damn good to me!"

Spot on!

 

[DeletedUser31931]

A BS US president who was given the Peace prize for torture, reducing freedoms and sanctioning drone strikes enmasse.

I don't have much to say on this debate anymore (I was arguing for NSA more for the fun of it and the challenge) however I would like to refute this statement.
A) Obama has done as much as possible in terms of things like shutting down Guantanamo Bay amongst other things however as he doesn't have Congress on his side enough he can't act out all the policies he wants to.
B) About your final statement, Obama actually drafted the law that made it so that the president had to sanction drone strikes. As far as I'm aware before that if the target was deemed a high enough threat and the parameters were filled then the US army/air force could launch their drone attack and not have to care about a thing.
C) Are you saying the Obamas a huge exception to this rule if he has done everything you claim he has. I'm pretty sure Bush let torture happen and um oh what's that thing called again, oh right gay rights. that's what it is. Was Gay marriage given the same benefits and taxes etc. as marriage under Bush? Yet again as far as I'm aware, no. Is it now? Yes. (so long as it's legally recognised which I think is stupid and homophobic (by the states, not Obama) and personally I think that there should be a law demanding that Gay marriage (or civil partnership if you want to be technical) is legalised in all states but that is for another debate.) If you want to cite gun control as restricting freedoms, I'm sorry but I don't count that as it was necessary in my opinion (and yet again I don't think that's gone through yet although I'm not American so I'm not entirely sure on your state of affairs).

 

[DeletedUser529]

Exactly, so why do you have anything to fear if you have nothing to hide? What could the NSA stand to gain from listening to your conversation about how you need someone to also get some peas from the supermarket, or more accurately, what could you stand to loose?

Let's closely examine what you have lost....

First of all you have lost your basic rights of privacy, whether you are innocent or guilty of any crime you have lost your basic right of saying NO and the court/judge needs proof of a wrong doing on your part. Like the Police/NSA etc coming to a legal authority and presenting some evidence showing you have done something wrong and further investigation NEEDS to be done.

Allot of people saying that if you have done nothing wrong and do not plan on doing anything wrong then all this privacy is meaningless.

BUT the power of this technology is JUST coming into it's own. Soon with Hundreds of billions of Dollars flow into this technology what will it be like say, 5 years from now. With all that data stored in its system. Once the program is in place all it needs is a massive amount of data to sort through and the more sophisticated the system and better the data flowing out the other end.

I have heard the spinsters say what they please about this intelligence gathering and it scares the hell out of me. The power they will soon have with several HUGE data collection buildings being built and two NEW super computers also being in development as we speak. With quantum Mechanical Computers they will be able of HUGE analyzation of this ENORMOUS data collecting they are presently doing.

The intelligence agencies of this world are reaping a fortune in data.....

The smart phone era is here right now and this little evil GADGET has placed a hook into Billions of people. A neat little spy gadget that anyone with any amount of hacking skills and a few small programs can turn these little MONSTERS into a very good spy machine, equipped with, GPS, MICS, AND CAMERAS.

Smart Phones and dumb people who own them.

 

[DeletedUser31931]

Ok, let's just examine one thing, because here is where I start laughing.

The intelligence agencies of this world are reaping a fortune in data

They don't need to. Some of them don't. Do you know why? Google does it for them, and so does Apple, and Microsoft and Yahoo. Even Duck Duck Go records some data which they store. All an intelligence force needs is a clever person who's willing to infiltrate Google and they've got their hands on one of the biggest data caches in the history of earth. Even if we do stop the intelligence agencies from gathering the data themselves, it doesn't matter, they can get it from another source, and there are plenty out there. Pay as you go hackers, none of them have really turned their attention to Google yet, but I'm pretty certain that if you got the world's elite on the same payroll they could crack it quite quickly and boom they have the data. The thing that matters is that the intelligence service doesn't use this data for evil or the purpose of taking over the world. And before you say they do and we just don't know it because of the mind wiping drugs in our water, think about this, the main argument against all conspiracy theories.

Think of every huge major scandal that has tried to be hushed up Bloodgate, Watergate, etc. in fact there is a rather large list of scandals on wikipedia (not the best source I know, but it's good for lists) where big companies or governments or secret services did something wrong and tried to hush it up, and it got out, because the bigger the secret the more likely it's going to get out, and if these secrets are on a national or even global level which they would be if they existed, they'd get out quite quickly. There will always be your good, trustworthy reliable whistleblower. To be honest if the governments wanted to take over they probably could do so quite easily and there wouldn't be much we could do to stop them realistically unless one of you is Bruce Willis in disguise. Therefore we don't really have much of an option in the matter, I'm not going to stop MI6 from doing anything, so why should I try and therefore make myself a target?

 

[DeletedUser]

The thing that matters is that the intelligence service doesn't use this data for evil or the purpose of taking over the world.

Government, by definition is a body of people, notably ungoverned. Those people in places of power will seek to use the information acquired through wiretaps and such for their own corrupt agendas.
Benjamin Franklin said that those who sacrifice personal liberty for temporary safety deserve neither.

There will always be your good, trustworthy reliable whistleblower.

...who will be persecuted, labeled as a 'traitor' and imprisoned. *cough* Manning. *cough* Snowden. *cough* Russ Tice *cough* William Binney *cough* Thomas Andrews Drake *cough* Thomas Tamm to name just a few.

 

[DeletedUser31931]

The whistle's still been blown though, and try as they might though the government can't undo that.

 

[DeletedUser]

The whistle's still been blown though, and try as they might though the government can't undo that.

No, but they can use misdirection to move the public eye to a different place.

 

[DeletedUser31931]

True but if the public are all mindless easily controlled dolts then what's the point of saving them anyway?

 

[DeletedUser]

Because then they might have the chance to be as they were born to be: free and independent.

 

[DeletedUser]

^ What Walter said.

The aim our governments is to ensure that we remain dormant as beings, so that they remain in power. Take Obama's new 'nudge squads' for instance (special government units with the aim of changing public opinion. Or, put more simply, spin doctors). That does not mean that the public cannot wake up and induce change.

 

[DeletedUser31931]

What people seem to forget is that politicians are part of the public. Also in reply to Walter, they wouldn't be. Have you read Animal Farm?

 

[DeletedUser]

The Napoleons of the world will always seek to concentrate all power to themselves. It doesn't mean that the victims of such sociopathic pigs want to be butchered and raped and never be able to know peace for themselves or for their progeny. Until such a time comes where the ruling class has genetically engineered a slave race and killed off every single freeborn man and woman, those who are able to do so have every obligation to continue to speak the truth and contend for life and liberty wherever possible, no matter how dire and hopeless the situation may seem.

And I would further submit that the cause of liberty will triumph in the end. As Mayor Orden remarked to Colonel Lanser at the closing of Steinbeck's The Moon Is Down, "You see, sir, nothing can change it. You will be destroyed and driven out. [...] The people don't like to be conquered, sir, and so they will not be. Free men cannot start a war, but once it is started, they can fight on in defeat. Herd men, followers of a leader, cannot do that, and so it is always the herd men who win battles and the free men who win wars. You will find that is so, sir."

 

[DeletedUser31931]

Liberty will triumph but Liberty will need a leader. Even if all men are equal, some are more equal than others. And whose to say that that Leader won't turn bad. When America voted Obama in the general reaction (as far as the papers made it out) was a sort of, we've done it, it's over. Now in his second term you all hate him or so you make out. Even if Liberty's leader (the bad one) is then replaced, you'll have one hell of a time finding someone that won't turn rotten.

 

[DeletedUser]

A leader/figurehead isn't always needed. Look at Anonymous. Ideally government should reflect the demands of the people, and carry those out in the most efficient way.

 

[DeletedUser31931]

There must be someone at the top of Anonymous organising it all. And anyway, what your proposing is anarchy, and whilst in anarchy most people would carry on with their normal lives, there's always that one nut job.

 

[DeletedUser]

There must be someone at the top of Anonymous organising it all. And anyway, what your proposing is anarchy, and whilst in anarchy most people would carry on with their normal lives, there's always that one nut job.

Actually, there isn't. I know some anons. And there really isn't. Anonymous isn't an organization, it's not even a movement. It's simply an idea. A collective of like-minded people merged into one voice. There is no leadership structure whatsoever. That is why they are so strong. I can direct you to some people who can tell you more if you want.

No, I'm not proposing anarchy. I'm proposing democracy.

 

[DeletedUser31931]

So who would enforce the laws?