Birthers and the Obama Conspiracy

[DeletedUser]

John McCain was born on August 29, 1936 at Coco Solo Naval Air Station in the Panama Canal Zone, Panama, to naval officer John S. McCain, Jr. (1911–1981) and Roberta (Wright) McCain (b. 1912). sorce

don't like that sorce they go it from ^ a b Timberg, American Odyssey, 17–34

Well, if you are using McCain's biography page on Wikipedia as the official source to make a point/counter-point to end a train of discussion, then:

"Barack Obama was born at the Kapi'olani Medical Center for Women & Children in Honolulu, Hawaii, United States, to Stanley Ann Dunham, an American of mainly English descent from Wichita, Kansas, and Barack Obama, Sr.," source

Thread should now be closed...

 

[DeletedUser]

you ever stop and that all the hospitals the Obama was said to be born (in HI) in are all still open eather Kapi'olani Medical Center for Women & Children or Queen's Medical Center

just read what this person has said
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Kapi'olani_Medical_Center_for_Women_&_Children
look under the topic "The Hospital of Obama's Birth is Unconfirmed and Should be Noted as Such"

infact if I can find it again on youtube there was a guy who was able to forge a copy of the paper used by Obama.

Do you think before you post?

Also, now you're trying to say he was born in 2 hospitals in HI? :dry:

Keep digging that hole deeper and deeper.

Youtube, great source.:laugh:

 

[DeletedUser]

Well, if you are using McCain's biography page on Wikipedia as the official source to make a point/counter-point to end a train of discussion, then:

"Barack Obama was born at the Kapi'olani Medical Center for Women & Children in Honolulu, Hawaii, United States, to Stanley Ann Dunham, an American of mainly English descent from Wichita, Kansas, and Barack Obama, Sr.," source

Thread should now be closed...

Do you think before you post?

Also, now you're trying to say he was born in 2 hospitals in HI? :dry:

Keep digging that hole deeper and deeper.

Youtube, great source.:laugh:

you are both not seeing it or reading it are you well here is all that is said so you can read it. (this is this guys words not mine)


"To say that the Kapi'olani Medical Center for Women & Children is the place of Obama's birth is to ignore all of the other legitimate sources that say that Queen's Medical Center is his birthplace. Neither hospital has been confirmed as his place of birth, therefore it is not truthful to state as a fact that he was born at Kapi'olani."

"The hospital is possibly the birthplace of Barack Obama, President of the United States, though various news reports have also listed The Queen's Medical Center as his birthplace."


"To sum it up: 1.) no official confirmation of the hospital of Obama's birth has been made and 2.) legitimate sources have stated that Obama was born at Kapi'olani while other legitimate sources have claimed that he was born at Queen's"

"How can you say that Kapi'olani is his birthplace, "definitively", as you say, when Obama and the hospital itself refuse to confirm or deny it?"

"Even if you still say that Queen's Medical Center should not be listed as a possible birthplace for Obama, there's no way you can say definitively that he was born at Kapi'olani since there has been no official confirmation of that. Therefore, I suggest that Queen's be added as a possible birthplace and that Kapi'olani be listed as another possible birthplace. Either that, or just completely remove any suggestion that he was born at either hospital. In fact, it would make more sense to just remove any reference to him being born at any hospital simply because we do not know for sure because no confirmation yet exists. Truthinyourface (talk) 00:46, 14 July 2009 (UTC)"


"news accounts have also variously reported his birth as having occurred at Queen's Medical Center in Honolulu."


"Just because you say it's confirmed, doesn't make it so. The hospital has denied to confirm it and so has the Obama administration. Wouldn't you agree? And if that's the case, which it is, then how can you say it's confirmed, because a bunch of people in Honolulu think so?"

 

[DeletedUser]

Why should we care in which hospital he was born? We have all that is needed...a valid birth certificate. Case closed.

 

[DeletedUser]

No. Hawaii didn't become a state until 2 years before he was born.

The US Code disagrees.

§ 1405. Persons born in Hawaii
A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30, 1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900.

I dont think I have ever disagreed w/ elmyr before but heres a first:
You can be born abroad and be president as long as BOTH parents are american citizens, His father is NOT an american citizen and so if he was not born in america , he is NOT eligble to be president.

The U.S. State Department agrees with me.

Birth Abroad to One Citizen and One Alien Parent in Wedlock: A child born abroad to one U.S. citizen parent and one alien parent acquires U.S. citizenship at birth under Section 301(g) INA provided the citizen parent was physically present in the U.S. for the time period required by the law applicable at the time of the child's birth. (For birth on or after November 14, 1986, a period of five years physical presence, two after the age of fourteen is required. For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986, a period of ten years, five after the age of fourteen are required for physical presence in the U.S. to transmit U.S. citizenship to the child.

 

[DeletedUser8950]

Why can't conspiritists just hold up there, admit it when they're wrong and get on with their lives, without coming up with all this wacky (cant use word I want to) that they waste hours arguing over and we waste hours proving wrong? Sometimes some conspircays have validity. This one has...let me see...none!
I'm not gonna waste time arguing this over, I doubt the conspiritst/s(possibly) will see reason either way.

 

[DeletedUser]

Why can't conspiritists just hold up there, admit it when they're wrong and get on with their lives, without coming up with all this wacky (cant use word I want to) that they waste hours arguing over and we waste hours proving wrong? Sometimes some conspircays have validity. This one has...let me see...none!
I'm not gonna waste time arguing this over, I doubt the conspiritst/s(possibly) will see reason either way.

I don't see why people are lableing this as a conspiracy though. 100% honest questions being ask conspircy therioists are useally wack jobs who think 9/11 was in inside Job. asking for Obama to make a statment that he is lagal with proof. not from a copy you can get off the internet that you can make at home.

 

[DeletedUser]

I don't see why people are lableing this as a conspiracy though. 100% honest questions being ask conspircy therioists are useally wack jobs who think 9/11 was in inside Job. asking for Obama to make a statment that he is lagal with proof. not from a copy you can get off the internet that you can make at hime.

Obama provided proof. You just choose not to acknowledge it because you don't like his politics. Again, see this: http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

And, since you have been given the answers, but simply choose not to accept them because you don't like the answers that you are getting, the questions are no longer, "100% honest"...

 

[DeletedUser]

you are both not seeing it or reading it are you well here is all that is said so you can read it. (this is this guys words not mine)

"Blablablablablablablahhhhhh"

"Booooooooo! Hisssssss!"

"We want official statements from hospitals! We demand it from all of our non-white presidents!"

"Yammery yammer, blah blah!"

"Even if you still say that Queen's Medical Center blahblahblah, whiiiiiine! Truthinyourface (talk) 00:46, 14 July 2009 (UTC)"

The hospital probably won't say either way because of PRIVACY laws.

And Quoting someone else's wiki:Talk rantings doesn't make us believe, it just shows us where you get your arguments from, and pretty much verbatim.

So it alll boils down to who cares, Gizmo? You're alone in this entire thread, nobody is going to suddenly believe you on here. He was born in Hawaii, he's your president, and you should be more occupied thanking the LORD that Bush wasn't allowed a 3rd term.

 

[DeletedUser]

I don't see why people are lableing this as a conspiracy though. 100% honest questions being ask conspircy therioists are useally wack jobs who think 9/11 was in inside Job. asking for Obama to make a statment that he is lagal with proof. not from a copy you can get off the internet that you can make at hime.

See Gizmo, you're talking and running your mouth when you don't make any goddamned sense and don't know what you're talking about. You're asking for things that he's already done but that doesn't matter to you because you're less worried about facts and more worried about making noise where there doesn't need to be noise. You're so worried about participating in a discussion and people taking you seriously that you overlook the important details and state laughably horrible opinions and speculations.

I wish, for once, you'd realize that this is why everyone gets aggravated when you post. Not because you're disagreeing as you so like to convince yourself, it's not that, it's the fact that you're so blatantly wrong in everything you say that it's frustrating. You're so pompous in declaring that you're right all the time when anyone with half a brain can recognize that you're so wrong it's not even funny. What's the point, Gizmo? I mean, what is your reason for blurting out such nonsense and digging a hole for yourself? If you want anyone to ever take you seriously on these forums or anywhere else in life, you're going to need to become informed and start applying common sense to what you say.

 

[DeletedUser]

The US Code disagrees.

I should have known you'd catch that. I realized after I posted that Hawaii was a territory of the US for several years before being given statehood.

 

[DeletedUser8950]

The hospital probably won't say either way because of PRIVACY laws.

And Quoting someone else's wiki:Talk crap doesn't make us believe, it just shows us where you get your arguments from, and pretty much verbatim.

So it alll boils down to who cares, Gizmo? You're alone in this entire thread, nobody is going to suddenly believe you on here. He was born in Hawaii, he's your president, and you should be more occupied thanking the LORD that Bush wasn't allowed a 3rd term.

Careful with your language, I got a warning for saying crap before lol.
This thread has no purpose other then burning time anymore (and not productively either lol) as giz refuses to listen to reason.

 

[DeletedUser]

He hasn't refused to do so. He provided an electronically scanned copy of his birth certificate on his website. Other people have also gotten a copy of his birth certificate. How many times does Hawaii have to say they have his birth certificate and that he was born there. I've seen his birth certificate being held by journalists on television many times.

So basically you are saying the Supreme Court and Hawaii are in this conspiracy and it started decades ago. Brilliant.

No, I'm not saying there's a conspiracy at all. I'm saying that any question of a conspiracy could be laid to rest easily. By providing an actual copy of the Long Form Birth Certificate.

The item which has been provided is NOT a birth certificate. It is a Certification of Live Birth, which SOUNDS like a birth cirtificate, but is not. What it is, is a form that affirms that Hawaii has a copy of his actual birth certificate.

The Supreme Court has never ruled on whether there's a Birth Certificate issue or not.

I'm not saying either way whether he is eligible based on his Citizenship.

 

[DeletedUser]

No, I'm not saying there's a conspiracy at all. I'm saying that any question of a conspiracy could be laid to rest easily. By providing an actual copy of the Long Form Birth Certificate.

Why should he? What purpose would it serve? If the Short Form Birth Certificate is good enough for the State Department, why shouldn't it be good enough for those that have doubts about his citizenship?

The item which has been provided is NOT a birth certificate. It is a Certification of Live Birth, which SOUNDS like a birth cirtificate, but is not. What it is, is a form that affirms that Hawaii has a copy of his actual birth certificate.

No, it IS a birth certificate. It is the SHORT FORM. And, again, why is it not sufficient? Especially since you indicate that if the state issues that, it affirms that the state has access to the long form birth certificate.

 

[DeletedUser]

He has. Uggghhh. The thing is, the people that buy into wack ideas like this don't listen. Do you really think that would work anyways? Look at the "He's a Muslim" crap. If he stated once he was a Christian and not a Muslim he said it dozens of times. People still don't believe him. They watch him walk into a church and pray with a minister and know he belonged to the same church and attended services there for years and years and still he is a Muslim to them. Open your eyes Giz.

This is the same Church that he later denied ever having paid any attention to what Reverend Wright was saying?

 

[DeletedUser]

Judging from the actions and behavior of most Christians that I know, I doubt most Christians really pay that much attention to their minister or the bible. Not all mind you, just most.

 

[DeletedUser]

Why should he? What purpose would it serve? If the Short Form Birth Certificate is good enough for the State Department, why shouldn't it be good enough for those that have doubts about his citizenship?



No, it IS a birth certificate. It is the SHORT FORM. And, again, why is it not sufficient? Especially since you indicate that if the state issues that, it affirms that the state has access to the long form birth certificate.

Because the electronic copy can be manipulated, A scanned copy of the original Long form would either exhibit the Hand Written information, or a type pattern and font consistent with manual typewriters of the time period, which could be independently verified as authentic and un-altered.




Once again, I don't support the conspiracy argument, I can only express my views on what evidence would be sufficient to completely silence the theories.

For Better or Worse, He was legitimately elected.

 

[DeletedUser]

"The Hawaii Department of Health's birth record request form does not give the option to request a photocopy of your long-form birth certificate..."

That's what I read from the link Adelei gave in post #12 of this thread...so all the people asking Obama to get the original copy, maybe they don't even give that option to the President, lol!

 

[DeletedUser]

Because the electronic copy can be manipulated, A scanned copy of the original Long form would either exhibit the Hand Written information, or a type pattern and font consistent with manual typewriters of the time period, which could be independently verified as authentic and un-altered.

AGAIN, all the proof that is required by the State Department is the short form. It wasn't just in electronic form, but a paper copy was provided to the press to examine and take photos of. Why should he dignify the completely baseless claims of his non-citizenship any further than he already has? If the short form is good enough for the State Department, then it is valid as proof of his citizenship. For those kooks that won't believe it...they wouldn't believe it with a long form...even if Obama did decide to dignify their baseless claims with a response...

 

[DeletedUser]

AGAIN, all the proof that is required by the State Department is the short form. It wasn't just in electronic form, but a paper copy was provided to the press to examine and take photos of. Why should he dignify the completely baseless claims of his non-citizenship any further than he already has? If the short form is good enough for the State Department, then it is valid as proof of his citizenship. For those kooks that won't believe it...they wouldn't believe it with a long form...even if Obama did decide to dignify their baseless claims with a response...

People that require long-form proof will never be sated, partly because they know they can't see it, since the State Department doesn't allow copies of it...so that will be the basis of their argument until the State Department says "FINE! Have it!" or until Obama's Presidency is up.