The Peacful Muslim Religion

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DeletedUser

Justin Michael said:
The Moors invaded Spain in 711. The first crusade was in 1095. A bit of an application of history would help you understand his question.
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Sorry, kid, you got it wrong, AGAIN. I mentioned nothing about the invasion of Spain, but if you really wish to discuss it...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umayyad_conquest_of_Hispania

As to the initial nature of the expedition, historical opinion takes four directions: (1) that a force was sent to aid one side in a civil war in the hope of plunder and a future alliance; (2) that it was a reconnaissance force sent to test the military strength of the Visigothic kingdom; (3) that it was the first wave of a full–scale invasion; (4) that it was an unusually large raiding expedition with no direct strategic intentions.

(While there are four general opinions, they tend to converge on (1) mentioned above)

Care to try again?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Guadalete

The Battle of Guadalete was fought in 711 or 712 at an unidentified location between the Christian Visigoths of Hispania under their king, Roderic, and an invading force of Muslim Arabs and Berbers under Ṭāriq ibn Ziyad. The battle was significant as the culmination of a series of Arab-Berber attacks and the beginning of the Islamic conquest of Hispania. In the battle Roderic probably lost his life, along with many members of the Visigothic nobility, opening the way for the capture of Visigothic capital of Toledo.
The battle is sometimes referred to as the Battle of La Janda, Battle of the Río Barbate, or Battle of the Transductine Promontories.




@JR Historians and Hispanists are in general (75% or more) agreement on the political motivation and alliance aspect of this invasion, that Tariq was invited / requested to help in many of the small battles being fought.
 

DeletedUser

lspiderl said:
jsut one small correction here Christianity didnt runt eh crusades CATHOLISISM did and there just ONE branch os christianity and oh yeah it was all under the orders of a PAGAN king who adopted catholisism to prevent uprising agianst his rule but eh whats a few MINOR details
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Except for the fact that the other religions hadn't broken off yet...So, those branches didn't exist. Try some other rationale.
 

DeletedUser

lspiderl said:
Slay the unbelievers wherever you find them.” Koran 2:191
“Make war on the infidels living in your neighborhood.” Koran 9:123
“When opportunity arises, kill the infidels wherever you catch them.” Koran 9:5
“Any religion other than Islam is not acceptable.” Koran 3:85
“The Jews and the Christians are perverts; fight them.” Koran 9:30
“Maim and crucify the infidels if they criticize Islam” Koran 5:33
“Punish the unbelievers with garments of fire, hooked iron rods, boiling water; melt their skin and bellies.” Koran 22:19
“The unbelievers are stupid; urge the Muslims to fight them.” Koran 8:65
“Muslims must not take the infidels as friends.” Koran 3:28
“Terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an.” Koran 8:12
“Muslims must muster all weapons to terrorize the infidels.” Koran 8:60
ANYONE ELSE WANT TO DISCUSS THE PEACFUL MUSLIM RELIGION?
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I'm sorry English is not good using the internet translator

I do not know where you read it right, but none of what you type so üzücü.Bunları değil.Müslüman religion is a religion of peace. I hope you understand what I typed, because the internet çeviremiyor: D Anyway, the first message is absolutely wrong. If you read the Koran unmodified slavery, wars are not ours nor lie nor görürsünüz.Çünkü launched Medinedeki infidels. It is their job gelmedi.Onlar inanmadıysa inanmadılar.Onlar God is not God we are serving our problem değil.Onların verecektir.Ne kill them What in the world of what you did after the death penalty savaşırız.Onlar inanmasada kardeşimizdir.Fakat we'll go to hell if we do not repent göreceğiz.Tüm people işlemiştir.Ve sin.
 

DeletedUser

procarfter said:
I'm sorry English is not good using the internet translator

I do not know where you read it right, but none of what you type so üzücü.Bunları değil.Müslüman religion is a religion of peace. I hope you understand what I typed, because the internet çeviremiyor: D Anyway, the first message is absolutely wrong. If you read the Koran unmodified slavery, wars are not ours nor lie nor görürsünüz.Çünkü launched Medinedeki infidels. It is their job gelmedi.Onlar inanmadıysa inanmadılar.Onlar God is not God we are serving our problem değil.Onların verecektir.Ne kill them What in the world of what you did after the death penalty savaşırız.Onlar inanmasada kardeşimizdir.Fakat we'll go to hell if we do not repent göreceğiz.Tüm people işlemiştir.Ve sin.
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sorry pro you missed where my post was taken out of context

it was to show why many people beleive its not a peaceful religion not a declaritive statement either way simply a counter to the discussion
 

DeletedUser

lspiderl said:
sorry pro you missed where my post was taken out of context

it was to show why many people beleive its not a peaceful religion not a declaritive statement either way simply a counter to the discussion
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And we showed you the same evidence from the Bible.

Yet you somehow claim that the evidence from the Bible is different.
 

DeletedUser

I don't want to argue about this, but it seems spider must read more than this. :)

And a note: Some of you say muslim people practice Quran's violent rules but the others not. Should I start counting the deaths made by America and Muslim people to compare? China killing minoraties, America flies half a globe away and bomb Iraq, Israeli killing people in Palestine (and Lebanon) for years and only Muslim's are killing people yes? [Don't worry, I know who has been killed by Muslims. I don't say we didn't kill anyone but you did :) ] You consider it really weird.

People are fighting everywhere. That's not a fault of Islam or any religion. Stop arguing like an fascist and be objective. How do you say you are a peaceful people with this hate-based speechs. Or if you are not, why it is a problem for you if Islam is not peaceful?
 

DeletedUser

Elisabeth Ramsey said:
I don't want to argue about this, but it seems spider must read more than this. :)

And a note: Some of you say muslim people practice Quran's violent rules but the others not. Should I start counting the deaths made by America and Muslim people to compare? China killing minoraties, America flies half a globe away and bomb Iraq, Israeli killing people in Palestine (and Lebanon) for years and only Muslim's are killing people yes? [Don't worry, I know who has been killed by Muslims. I don't say we didn't kill anyone but you did :) ] You consider it really weird.

People are fighting everywhere. That's not a fault of Islam or any religion. Stop arguing like an fascist and be objective. How do you say you are a peaceful people with this hate-based speechs. Or if you are not, why it is a problem for you if Islam is not peaceful?
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no ones saying other people dont kill people theres wars and killing all over hte world but its primarily islam that people use as religous justification for terrorist killings

war is differnt then terrorism

in war there are rules of engagement

countries do there absolute best to only attack other military targets and to minimize civilian casualties

in acts fo terroism they attack priomarily inoccent non combatants and non military targets in order to invoke fear in a population its a very differnt thing




and if moderate muslims are hte majority then they need to take ownership of there religoin

they need to speakout agianst the radicals , they need to be sure there places of worship arnt harboring radicals

the 9/11 attacks it was confirmed were planned in mosques and organized in mosques to avoid scrutiny

its hard to beleive that NO one at the mosque knew they were up to somethin even if they didnt know exactly what

if they had susspitions actions could ahve been taken even if it was as simple as calling hte fbi or other law inforcement and saying hey i think these guys are plannign something keep an eye on them
 
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DeletedUser

Taking your comment from the other thread and quoting it here, as it is more applicable to this discussion, and effectively rebuts your above drivel.

lspiderl said:
lastly its rare that you see religous people (aside from mulsim extreemists ) involved in violent actions for religous reasons and more often then not religous folks are simply fighting for equal rights yet constantly nonn religous folks attack the religous folks rights
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You really are clueless, aren't you?

  • The still active Christian Sons of Freedom, responsible for arson and bombings,
  • The National Liberation Front of Tripura, a Christian terrorist organization in India, accused of a wide range of actions, including forcible conversion of citizenry to Christianity,
  • The National Socialist Council of Nagaland, a recognized terrorist organization, whose call is, "‘Nagaland for Christ,"
  • The Iron Guard and Lăncieri, now defunct anti-Semitic Romanian Orthodox groups that participated in the Holocaust, committed political murders, and otherwise terrorized non-Christians,
  • The Russian National Unity is a paramilitary/terrorist group advocating theocratic government under the Russian Orthodox Church,
  • The Lord's Resistance Army is a quasi-military/terrorist Christian organization in Uganda, known for a number of atrocities.
  • The Ku Klux Clan, while no longer a major factor in the U.S., it still merits recognition as a terrorist organization, particularly with the new forms it presents itself as in the U.S. and abroad.
  • The Hutaree, which is alleged to mean, "Christian Warriors," were a terrorist organization just recently busted by the FBI,
  • And then there's Waco, an incident with so-called Christian patriots. In actuality, they were a paramilitary organization bent on committing terrorist acts,
Etc and so on...
 

DeletedUser

Hellstromm said:
Taking your comment from the other thread and quoting it here, as it is more applicable to this discussion, and effectively rebuts your above drivel.


You really are clueless, aren't you?

  • The still active Christian Sons of Freedom, responsible for arson and bombings,
  • The National Liberation Front of Tripura, a Christian terrorist organization in India, accused of a wide range of actions, including forcible conversion of citizenry to Christianity,
  • The National Socialist Council of Nagaland, a recognized terrorist organization, whose call is, "‘Nagaland for Christ,"
  • The Iron Guard and Lăncieri, now defunct anti-Semitic Romanian Orthodox groups that participated in the Holocaust, committed political murders, and otherwise terrorized non-Christians,
  • The Russian National Unity is a paramilitary/terrorist group advocating theocratic government under the Russian Orthodox Church,
  • The Lord's Resistance Army is a quasi-military/terrorist Christian organization in Uganda, known for a number of atrocities.
  • The Ku Klux Clan, while no longer a major factor in the U.S., it still merits recognition as a terrorist organization, particularly with the new forms it presents itself as in the U.S. and abroad.
  • The Hutaree, which is alleged to mean, "Christian Warriors," were a terrorist organization just recently busted by the FBI,
  • And then there's Waco, an incident with so-called Christian patriots. In actuality, they were a paramilitary organization bent on committing terrorist acts,
Etc and so on...
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every one of those groups acts in expressly unchristian ways and in spite of there claim to be christans are in fact not


furthermore there actions ARE publicaly denounced by the chrisian comunity so thanks agian for proving my point
 

DeletedUser

Oh, are you still hate-mongering Muslims spider?

Look, Religions are different, people are different & people have different beliefs.

If you continue to hate-monger Muslims, I'm afraid something will have to be done to you in PM.

Some criminals are Christians, and if they commit an act against a Muslim it is considered a normal offence. If a Muslim criminal attacks a Christian, it's as if there was another 9/11.
 

DeletedUser

AJ Ray said:
Oh, are you still hate-mongering Muslims spider?

Look, Religions are different, people are different & people have different beliefs.

If you continue to hate-monger Muslims, I'm afraid something will have to be done to you in PM.

Some criminals are Christians, and if they commit an act against a Muslim it is considered a normal offence. If a Muslim criminal attacks a Christian, it's as if there was another 9/11.
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oh are you still blindly responding to discussions without even bothering to take the time to READ anything thats been said in the like several pages ?
 

DeletedUser

lspiderl said:
every one of those groups acts in expressly unchristian ways and in spite of there claim to be christans are in fact not
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Muslims have indicated the actions of the Jihadists, and the actions of those in the 9/11 attacks were expressly unMuslim, and have publicly denounced said actions, but you conveniently ignore that.

lspiderl said:
furthermore there actions ARE publicaly denounced by the chrisian comunity so thanks agian for proving my point
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What exactly comprises of the Christian community? Because there are a lot of Christians that back the actions of one or more of these particular groups. The fact you're so dang ignorant of these issues is exactly why I'm bringing them up to denounce your hypocrisy.

You do realize I debunked your claim that Christians don't participate in such actions, right?
 
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DeletedUser

Hellstromm said:
Muslims have indicated the actions of the Jihadists, and the actions of those in the 9/11 attacks were expressly unMuslim, and have publicly denounced said actions, but you conveniently ignore that.


What exactly comprises of the Christian community? Because there are a lot of Christians that back the actions of one or more of these particular groups. The fact you're so dang ignorant of these issues is exactly why I'm bringing them up to denounce your hypocrisy.

You do realize I debunked your claim that Christians don't participate in such actions, right?
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youve done no such thing


theres CLEAR defining charicteristics and behaivoirs for a christian

those performing those actions break allmost all of those rules therefore in spite of there CLAIMS to be christians they are not

i could totaly CLAIM to be a muslim doesnt mean i AM no matter how much i claim it


the radical islamists have justification of there actions in there holy texts
 

DeletedUser

epic fail...

So now your claim is, "they aren't representative of Christians, therefore I stand by my assertion that Christians don't commit such actions."

Well buddy, they are Christians and, in fact, there are clergy and all associated with these groups. They have interpreted the Bible in a way different than you have, but they are still Christians and they are, indeed, terrorists.

Just as there are Islamists saying the persons who participated in 9/11, and the Jihadists, are not true Muslims, you are saying these terrorists are not true Christians. In this manner, both you and they can weasel out of denouncing the actions of these Muslim/Christian extremists. By claiming they aren't "true Christians," or "true Islamists," you are trying to distance yourself from their actions whilst not actually denouncing their actions.

Get it? Here, let me help you. You're wrong --- again.
 

DeletedUser

rofl agian you show your bias and your complete inability to grasp the differnces in situations
 

DeletedUser

I did not read the earlier posts, I just read the topic.... well.. my opinion is simple:

Islam is a good product but we [Muslims] are the bad marketers.........

:/

Simple.... We need some good marketers first ...... and before that a good CEO
:p
[not those Iranian people]

 
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