That time of year again.

[Diggo11]

Christmas: You're doing it wrong

As I think John and others have already pointed out, it is not at all hypocritical for non Christians to celebrate it. Many religious traditions will have their version of the celebration around this time as well, including those of pagan origin.

What is incorrect is in fact the umbrella name Christmas, that western populations have given the celebration. Christmas is the Christian version of what you've been calling the "winter festivals", which I also believe is wrong as I sit here typing this in 40 degrees celcius heat If you wanted to choose a more correct umbrella name for them, the December Solstice celebrations would be the go over Christmas.

 

[DeletedUser]

I don't want to complicate things with Atheists and religion folks again,but

Where ever a party is,its good!

 

[DeletedUser]

I don't want to complicate things with Atheists and religion folks again,but

Where ever a party is,its good!

New Year is a party, Christmas is being together with most of your relatives, some or most of whom you may dislike.

 

[DeletedUser]

Meh, getting together with your relatives for Christmas/Jul/Saturnalia/Hannukah/Winter Solstice/Summer Solstice used to be an exciting venture, but always disappointing. Now, it's just a time that goes by with my bank account being just a tad smaller than before, my relatives since gone to the five corners of the Earth. I make net purchases, have their gifts delivered, remember the departed, and suffer the memories. Then I go off and buy myself a few things, be my own Santa. I just wish I could help those in Haiti, but the problem is political, not manpower or money.

 

[DeletedUser]

You're still exaggerating. And you really don't know what was considered, "wild" by Christians at the time, now do you?

hehe, this so-called article was written by a guy named, Dimitry, who provided no sources in his article and no information about himself. Remember that old rule about research TTR? It's the same one journalists live by --- verify your sources. ​

Anyway, I reviewed this Dimitry's article, and it's rife with incorrect information. But, if you really want to believe a stranger's unsubstantiated tripe, by all means.​

That was litteraly the first thing on Saturnia I could find without it being from Wikipedia. But let me put up another source, one listed on Wikipedia itself.

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Drinking, noise and games and dice, appointing of kings and feasting of slaves, singing naked, clapping of frenzied hands, an occasional ducking of corked faces in icy water—such are the functions over which I preside."

http://penelope.uchicago.edu/~grout/encyclopaedia_romana/calendar/saturnalia.html
Caesar's Calendar (2007) by Denis Feeney; Mutilation and Transformation: Damnatio Memoriae and Roman Imperial Portraiture (2004) by Eric R. Varner.
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Thats wild by even todays standards, so why do you continue saying that I'm exagerating? The article also supports what I said about gambling being made public for everyone.

 

[DeletedUser]

New Year is a party, Christmas is being together with most of your relatives, some or most of whom you may dislike.

I think you dont understand.Christmas as New Year is celebrating as well.Isnt being with your family and friends(people you love)the greatest thing ever?

why would someone dislike his own relatives?Isn't Christmas and other holidays about love,forgivness, friendship and such?
This was my opinion on Christmas(party time)because if I would go on the same way as others,it wouldn't end up well.

I think you're trying to provoke something negative.Are you pointing out something?
"That Time of year again".What time?
Isn't it nice to see people celebrating together no matter "what time of year"it is?

 

[DeletedUser]

I think you dont understand.Christmas as New Year is celebrating as well.Isnt being with your family and friends(people you love)the greatest thing ever?

It is, but not always. Depends on the company you're with.

why would someone dislike his own relatives?

Wow, I can't believe you're even asking this? I take it that you must get along perfectly with all your relatives then. But for half of the people there are relatives they rather wouldn't see, be it parents, grandparents, brothers and sisters, cousins etc. You can't except everyone to get along with their family.

I think you're trying to provoke something negative.Are you pointing out something?
"That Time of year again".What time?

I think its different for every individual.

Isn't it nice to see people celebrating together no matter "what time of year"it is?

Like I said, it depends on the people you're celebrating with.

 

[DeletedUser]

It is, but not always. Depends on the company you're with.



Wow, I can't believe you're even asking this? I take it that you must get along perfectly with all your relatives then. But for half of the people there are relatives they rather wouldn't see, be it parents, grandparents, brothers and sisters, cousins etc. You can't except everyone to get along with their family.



I think its different for every individual.



Like I said, it depends on the people you're celebrating with.

1.You choose your company.If you dislike someone,then don't celebrate with them nothin'.
2.Your family is your family.I understand that not everyone gets along with their relatives,but again,if you "dislike"your family for any reason,don't meat with them.Or at least be a little more tolerant and forgiving.
3.Not every celebration must be just drinking and eating.Right?
4.AGAIN.If you're doing something against your will,don't do it at all.Same with celebrating with someone you "dislike".
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Let's put you or me away from celebrating.If you see people truly having fun with their friends and relatives by celebrating Christmas(or any holiday)
,does that make you a little bit more happy?

 

[DeletedUser]

I think you know that we can't always choose the company.

And yes, if everyone get along and are having fun, then there's nothing wrong with that. But other times people just put on their happy faces and pretend that they're enjoying the company. Im sure that you've had that feeling atleast once in your life.

 

[DeletedUser]

Christmas origins are a mishmash of various winter celebrations, inclusive of Scandanavian Yule, Roman's Saturnalia, etc. Btw, calling things "pagan" because they aren't Christian is disparaging and demonstrates, once again, many Christians think they are superior.

Anyway, there's nothing about Christmas that is Christian. . . .

Hello, Hellstromm. Exactly.

If there is nothing "Christian" about Christmas, then it is "pagan." Thank you for explaining what you were trying to refute.

Christianity has a long history of converting non-Christian celebrations into Christian ones (such as in the cases of Easter and Halloween).

Right on again, Hellstromm. The goal of the early Catholic church was to unify the Roman empire under one religion. Strategically, a smart thing to do.

It'd be called Mas then. Christmas litteraly means Christ's Mass (sort of self explanitory...).

No, the mass (shortened to "mas") is Catholic. It would be called by its local pagan name. All of these pagan celebrations were to worship the sun.

To Nashy, in the U.S., early settlers were actually prohibited to celebrate Christmas using floats and trees and such like today, especially around New England. They wanted to observe it as a solemn holiday honoring Jesus.

I know that there were restrictions on Christmas in many of the colonies, but I'd like for you to back up your statement as to their reason with a source.

exactly. any winter celebration has nothing to do with religion, but is merely an event to celebrate the coming of spring and the end of the year. and of course an excuse to get as much food and drink into you as is possible.

QFT

 

[DeletedUser]

No, the mass (shortened to "mas") is Catholic. It would be called by its local pagan name. All of these pagan celebrations were to worship the sun.

Well spotted, but my intention was still the same of having the name being changed if you wanted to celebrate it only in the pagan way and block out the Christian way of the holiday.

I know that there were restrictions on Christmas in many of the colonies, but I'd like for you to back up your statement as to their reason with a source.

Sure.

It seems that mainly strict northern puritins outlawed the celebration of the holiday with evergreens, nativity scenes, etc.

Other articles on this site and on the web state the same thing. Of course, not all americans abloished Christmas celebration and they managed to carry on the celebrations to today.

 

[DeletedUser]

I think you know that we can't always choose the company.

And yes, if everyone get along and are having fun, then there's nothing wrong with that. But other times people just put on their happy faces and pretend that they're enjoying the company. Im sure that you've had that feeling atleast once in your life.

Well yeah,but in that time I couldnt choose.Now I can.
I'm not planning to spend the rest of my life "celebrating with people I dislike".
That's why I'm not interested in those kind of people.That is,not interested in "celebrating"with them.

So if Christmas or any holiday by your claims, is gathering of people who dislike each other(mostly thats the case)then we're better off without any kind holiday.

 

[DeletedUser]

Well yeah,but in that time I couldnt choose.Now I can.
I'm not planning to spend the rest of my life "celebrating with people I dislike".
That's why I'm not interested in those kind of people.That is,not interested in "celebrating"with them.

So if Christmas or any holiday by your claims, is gathering of people who dislike each other(mostly thats the case)then we're better off without any kind holiday.

If you failed to understand my point then there is nothing more to discuss.

 

[DeletedUser]

I think all the December holidays should just be combined into one big 'ol holiday and be called the December Holiday. No fancy terms, no fancy gimmicks, it should just be about love, your family, some presents here and there if you feel like it, and happiness. Not about some "Messiah's" birth or whatever. It should just be a time to be happy and joyful. Nothing more, and nothing less.

 

[DeletedUser]

I think all the December holidays should just be combined into one big 'ol holiday and be called the December Holiday. No fancy terms, no fancy gimmicks, it should just be about love, your family, some presents here and there if you feel like it, and happiness. Not about some "Messiah's" birth or whatever. It should just be a time to be happy and joyful. Nothing more, and nothing less.

that may be true but no matter what day is Chosen there will alway be multiple groups of people that will fight it. like those who Celebrate the Winter Solstice will fight for it to be the 21/22. those who celebrate Hanukkah will want it on the date they Celebrate it ( 25th day of Kislev, which falls in December) and of course those who Celebrate Kwanzaa will want it on December 26. and of course Christmas on the 25th
so having a single holiday in December would be, what it the phrase im looking for, not politically correct and would just cause Chaos in the end.

 

[DeletedUser]

I think all the December holidays should just be combined into one big 'ol holiday and be called the December Holiday. No fancy terms, no fancy gimmicks, it should just be about love, your family, some presents here and there if you feel like it, and happiness. Not about some "Messiah's" birth or whatever. It should just be a time to be happy and joyful. Nothing more, and nothing less.

Couldn't agree more.

 

[DeletedUser]

that may be true but no matter what day is Chosen there will alway be multiple groups of people that will fight it. like those who Celebrate the Winter Solstice will fight for it to be the 21/22. those who celebrate Hanukkah will want it on the date they Celebrate it ( 25th day of Kislev, which falls in December) and of course those who Celebrate Kwanzaa will want it on December 26. and ove course Christmas on the 25th
so having a single holiday in December would be, what it the phrase im looking for, not politically correct and would just cause Chaos in the end.

Then let it be a month long holiday! It will start on the first of December, and end on New Years Eve. It will make everybody happy, and if some nutcase has a problem with it, then I'll listen to them too!

Honestly Giz, in the words of a couple of Rolling Stones, "You Can't Always Get What You Want." I know I probably won't get one nice little holiday. But a man can hope.

 

[DeletedUser]

Honestly Giz, in the words of a couple of Rolling Stones, "You Can't Always Get What You Want." I know I probably won't get one nice little holiday. But a man can hope.

so then why force every person to Celebrate you little holiday why they can just Celebrate their little holiday. Just like I think that we should keep stores open on Holidays for those who wish to not Celibate the holiday can work on that day and not have the day off from work.
but Hey if someone wants to believe a man breaks into your house and drops off toys. or a fictional bunny rabbit hides Chicken eggs around your house be my guest (easter). but I know what im celebrating these days for.

 

[DeletedUser]

Sure.

It seems that mainly strict northern puritins outlawed the celebration of the holiday with evergreens, nativity scenes, etc.

I believe that you are reading it wrong. The Puritans were outlawing the observance of Christmas in any manner: solemn or not.

That is what I remembered; thank you for the source.

 

[DeletedUser]

Then let it be a month long holiday! It will start on the first of December, and end on New Years Eve. It will make everybody happy, and if some nutcase has a problem with it, then I'll listen to them too!

Honestly Giz, in the words of a couple of Rolling Stones, "You Can't Always Get What You Want." I know I probably won't get one nice little holiday. But a man can hope.

yeah one little problem with that, yes, i like the idea of an entire month-long winter celebration, but it is simply not practical, no-one could get food, and the world's ecomony would grind to a halt, so in theory, if everyone followed you ida, the world would be in financial crisis by the end of december, i'm sorry, but it simply does not work.