Israel: Why Can't The PLO Live WIth Jews?

[DeletedUser]

gilad512

dress it up how you want but that is an ignorant, naive at best, sweeping statement which is racist.

The issue is more complex than Palestinians are terrorists and are constantly bombing Israel. Do you think it is a dance with one partner?

Sure, hold that belief if you want to, if it sits better with who you are, but don't pretend it is an informed or intelligent belief, or that it isn't bigoted, prejudiced or racially inflamatory.

 

[DeletedUser]

So Beta, you are saying this forum is only a place for liberals?

Moving on I think gilad has a point. A Palestinian state would merely concentrate on waging stronger assaults on Israel as proven by their rhetoric. Plus a Palestinian state would be an ethnic nationalist state.

Wouldn't it be better if they united in one Israeli civil state? After all the Israelis don't discriminate against the Muslims who live in Israel.

 

[DeletedUser]

So Beta, you are saying this forum is only a place for liberals?

lol, he was referring to naive, bigoted, prejudiced or racist people. So you're saying he's describing conservatives?

 

[DeletedUser12933]

Now now Bat. Yes there's a lot of anger and stupidity associated with the entire scenario. However we can't nuke or explode every stupid situation we find. In this case the two sides must work towards peace. An act that can be done IF both are willing to live in the same nation.




Are the Palestinians really oppressed? For Pete's sake! They have an entire street covered in un-bombed, intact offices for the PLO to occupy once Palestinian independence would be firmly established. If the Israelis are so oppressive they would at least bomb these symbols of a separatist movement, no? Oppressor and oppressed, there is no such thing here.



Alright, so it's fine if we allow ethnic states to be established? Because later on the "world community" will fix them? And you automatically say Israeli discrimination without acknowledging Palestinian discrimination also, if you're going to complain about the sides it's best to whine about both.

My racist prejudices, let's see the facts that establish me as a racist and a bigot.

1. I support the existence of the state of Israel in its entirety.

2. I oppose a Palestinian state on the grounds it would have a discriminatory ethnic basis.

Hmmm... Now I know how Glenn Beck feels...



Go to page one post #8. I outlined the history involved and I can tell you there was no stealing. The initial Jewish immigrants purchased lands from landlords who evicted the previous tenants before they arrived. The Jews moved onto their legally purchased land minimal awareness that they'd played a part in evicting Arab farmers. I won't bother telling you the etymology of the word Jew (the word itself in English can be traced back to 1000) so here's an article that outlines it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jew_(word). Your third statement gives a statistic I could not verify. Please verify it. As for the rest of the idea...



How interesting that you should bring up an old anti-Semitic theory.



Alright kid, now if anyone is going to be called bigoted and racist, I think I have a nominee. But, I'm better than that and will simply say that it's quite annoying that you should recite this politically correct version of "Jews rule the world and are the cause of all problems"! I have some recommended reading for you, "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" and this beautiful assertion from the Daily Beast the Anders Breivik is a zionist fanatic (http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...m-in-line-with-pro-israel-european-right.html). Now be a good little boy and read your anti-Semitic propaganda.

Ok well done you have fallen for the biggest trap with Zionism. First of all Zionism is a political movement and has nothing to do with race calling me bigot or racist for critisising Zionism is like calling dislike for Republicans Racist. Secondly when did the Jewish faith become a race? its a faith nothing more and nothing less no race about it.....you my friend have swallowed the propaganda perfectly well, now try and rinse it down with some truth.

I don't doubt for a moment Jewish immigrants (key word their IMMIGRANTS) bough land from land lords quite fairly, but what has gone on since is nothing but theft and persecution of course the Zionist controlled Western Media are very cagey with the truth. Lets not forget the first terrorist organization in Palestine were Jewish funded by the Rothchild family and friends.

To sum it up you really need to brush up on your facts and forget about mainstream history victors write the history and that does not mean it is the correct history. As I said earlier the Jews have been lied to and used more than anyone in the last 100 years all in all to bring about that carbuncle of a state called Israel.

 

[DeletedUser]

lol, he was referring to naive, bigoted, prejudiced or racist people. So you're saying he's describing conservatives?

Nothing I can reply with could better Hellstrom's :laugh: though I didn't say don't be here, I was simply pointing out the futility of trying to win an argument with right wing politics against people with left wing politics and that you'd have more success with that on different types of forums.


You know, Hellstrom, that'll be making me chuckle for days. Cheers

 

[DeletedUser]

Ok well done you have fallen for the biggest trap with Zionism. First of all Zionism is a political movement and has nothing to do with race calling me bigot or racist for critisising Zionism is like calling dislike for Republicans Racist. Secondly when did the Jewish faith become a race? its a faith nothing more and nothing less no race about it.....you my friend have swallowed the propaganda perfectly well, now try and rinse it down with some truth.

I don't doubt for a moment Jewish immigrants (key word their IMMIGRANTS) bough land from land lords quite fairly, but what has gone on since is nothing but theft and persecution of course the Zionist controlled Western Media are very cagey with the truth. Lets not forget the first terrorist organization in Palestine were Jewish funded by the Rothchild family and friends.

To sum it up you really need to brush up on your facts and forget about mainstream history victors write the history and that does not mean it is the correct history. As I said earlier the Jews have been lied to and used more than anyone in the last 100 years all in all to bring about that carbuncle of a state called Israel.

Does anyone see this? Because I've been ID'ed as a racist and a bigot (which I'm not) it entitles me to be affronted with this crap. Zionist controlled media! Does anyone see this? It's a slight rejiggering of Jews control the media. Then to top it off he says they (the Jewish people) are too dumb to figure out they're being used. Not only that but he denies the existence of an Israelite ethnicity (not that that matters in Israel) and note how I didn't deny that Palestinians are there own separate people from other Arabs.

Then he talks about the terrorists funded by the Rothchilds. While they were not nice people that's a twisting of history. (By the way I think I found the kind of stuff you sir regularly read http://www.iamthewitness.com/DarylBradfordSmith_Rothschild.htm) I couldn't stand how many times crap like Illuminati and Ashkenazi conspiracy were spewed forth and couldn't find your reference. Please show me the early terrorists the Rothchilds funded and your references. I simply can't wait to see your "accurate" references.

The Zionist movement is and always has been a Jewish political movement to establish a Jewish homeland. I prefer my mainstream history because in this case there isn't a respectable person on this planet that would deny it. Zionism is a political movement, but a Jewish political movement. It sickens me the distortions that are tolerated here.

(Of course maybe I'm getting in a tizzy over a bufoon that everyone else ignores, I shouldn't even argue with this guy if he presents more "true" history.)

lol, he was referring to naive, bigoted, prejudiced or racist people. So you're saying he's describing conservatives?

Well thank you for clearing that up Hellstromm. By the way show me how I'm a racist. I'm real curious about that one. As for prejudiced and bigoted (definition of bigot, One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ) arguably I'll proudly wear those badges because so far you've failed to persuade me and your failure means that some of you now resort to name calling. So call me a bigot and prejudiced, I may say the same of you no? But, don't call me racist there are no grounds for that.

@Kaspiro- If it makes you better read this http://www.dailypaul.com/171416/isr...ldiers-to-penetrate-american-forums-chatrooms. Now you can wonder who I am. Teeheehee!

 

[DeletedUser]

I cannot believe some things I read here!
According to the reasoning of some people here the following would be true:
The whites immigrating to US did not technically "steal" the native land since the "paid" a couple of dollars for Manhattan, and they clearly paid the French for "The Louisiana purchase" etc. And those natives "didn't do anything with the land" anyway.
Cortez had all right to slaughter those barbarians because their God was not his and they had stuff he wanted.
The Europeans in South Africa knew all along what was best for the "black terrorists", and for that matter, the entire African continent. Nice maps drawn up going right true village centers blatantly disregarding the African tribes "natural" borders between themselves.
Rome was right when they ruled 2/3 of the known world.
Kublai Khan was right when he ruled 1/2 the known world
Napoleon was right when he ruled 1/4 of the known world. And on and on.
China knows what's best for Mongolia and Tibet. At least if you are Chinese.
The "Brit's" knew all along what was best for Ireland (genocide), India and all the rest of their colonies that they ran with a stiff upper lip, benevolence and the knowledge that English imperialistic civilization was in the best interest of those poor people, and nice taxes (robbery) coming "home" to England. Which prompted (terrorist) Gandhi to reply when asked what he thought of western civilization, "It think it would be a good idea".

USA are today the worlds (self proclaimed) police force (read; today's imperialistic power) coinciding with their oil (and other raw material) interests. This force have created far more problems then solutions, and are mainly there because the military industrial complex need to test their weapons, and their is still no easier way to steal the American taxpayers money then to wave the flag and call for "patriotism". Hermann Goering was right: http://quotes.liberty-tree.ca/quote/hermann_goering_quote_65d2

US still lives (since the end of world war 2) under the macro economic idea that no economy is better then a war economy (that might be changing now, but I doubt it). And the people of US wonders "why do they hate us?". Well "they" don't, "they" hate your foreign policy, just as "they" hated any other "well meaning" oppressor. "They" love American fashion, music, art, products etc, and no nation has ever in the planets history got more support and well wishing after a catastrophe as US got after 9-11. African farmers where giving their livestock in support off US, all squandered by Bush and his cronies. The invasion of Iraq after 9-11 should have landed the entire administration at the court in Hague!

Israel is a terrorist nation with no better record then the nations who it "defends" itself against. Their secret police gives themselves the "right" to assassinate whomever wherever on the planet. Israel has repeatedly denied any insight in their nuclear capabilities, thought to have at least 50-500, and the means to deliver them. Iraq has none as Hans Blix barely had time to tell us before Bush, Powell and Tenet lied in front of UN! Iran has none! For every killed Israeli many many more Palestinians have died; http://www.ifamericansknew.org/ .
The Idea that one is right, the other wrong, based on if they are on "your side" or not, disqualifies you to voice any "opinions" at all! The way you are reasoning is that Hitler was right if you where a citizen of one of the nation under the axis alliance.

Your reasoning is that might makes right, something I surely do not agree with.

Any and all who have lived working for the right of the average man have been right in their fight against the powers (who ever that might be), have been, are, and always will be right! It's not about politicks but about human rights, dignity in your life. The right to live you're life without getting screwed by some dictator, priest, oligarch of any kind. Getting your land stolen due to annexation, or your water stolen so some corporation can sell it back to you! Individual human rights.

 

[DeletedUser]

Well thank you for clearing that up Hellstromm. By the way show me how I'm a racist. I'm real curious about that one.

Lol, you're the one who associated naivety, bigotry, prejudice and racism with conservativism. No reason to get ruffled with me for offering ketchup to go along with that foot you repeatedly insert in your mouth. *smirk*

 

[DeletedUser1121]

There are some interesting developments in the Israel vs Palestina case. There will be a vote on the 20 september in the UN to recognise Palestina as an official state. IIRC it will go to vote in the security council first. Ofcourse America will veto this request. After that it will be sent to the UN, where all the associated countries can vote. Palestina will need a 2/3 majority to go through with this plan. The latest numbers i have seen is that they will have 130 of the 192 countries to vote yes. That is a 2/3 majority.

So what will happen if Palestina is an official state? How can you be a state if you have no clear borders?

 

[DeletedUser]

There are some interesting developments in the Israel vs Palestina case. There will be a vote on the 20 september in the UN to recognise Palestina as an official state. IIRC it will go to vote in the security council first. Ofcourse America will veto this request. After that it will be sent to the UN, where all the associated countries can vote. Palestina will need a 2/3 majority to go through with this plan. The latest numbers i have seen is that they will have 130 of the 192 countries to vote yes. That is a 2/3 majority.

So what will happen if Palestina is an official state? How can you be a state if you have no clear borders?

I haven't read the full resolution, but I suppose they will use the 1967 borders, which are generally internationally accepted and recognised in previous UN resolutions.

 

[DeletedUser]

come'on

Im not saying that all of the Palestinians are terrorists.
but if you want to hear a true story than :
Today 18/8/2011 12:15 3 terrorist attack in Israel .
1.terrorists shot on a bus with innocent people and soldjers on their way home.
2.2 bombs explode on innocent people and the 3rd 1 on soldjers that tried to stop the terrorists.
3. terrorists shot missile on a car.

I can't tell you right now how many people died and how many injured because it still going on.


any way i don't hate muslims or somthing like that . i just hate terrorists and in Gaza the terrorists rules the Palestinians people . Im sure that most of the Palestinians don't want it to be that way. But that just the way it is.

you can read about it right here :http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/08/18/israel-radio-says-second-bus-attacked-by-gunfire/

 

[DeletedUser]

Lol, you're the one who associated naivety, bigotry, prejudice and racism with conservativism. No reason to get ruffled with me for offering ketchup to go along with that foot you repeatedly insert in your mouth. *smirk*

*Slaps Forehead* Note to self, American politics should not be mentioned in dealing with Midlle Eastern politics.

There are some interesting developments in the Israel vs Palestina case. There will be a vote on the 20 september in the UN to recognise Palestina as an official state. IIRC it will go to vote in the security council first. Ofcourse America will veto this request. After that it will be sent to the UN, where all the associated countries can vote. Palestina will need a 2/3 majority to go through with this plan. The latest numbers i have seen is that they will have 130 of the 192 countries to vote yes. That is a 2/3 majority.

So what will happen if Palestina is an official state? How can you be a state if you have no clear borders?

Don't worry about the US vetoing the request. There is a certain president his name is Obama. And he's out to make a change, for the "betterment" of the Palestinians of course. If you were to check the current Administration's record with Israel you'd realize that they (the Israelis) are not exactly being given lollipops for associating themselves with the US at the moment. In fact Israel is so pissed off they're looking for new allies, such as China (http://joshuapundit.blogspot.com/2011/08/chinas-chief-of-staff-visits-israel-to.html (Yes it's a blog, but I think it's a good summary and their are links to news articles). So maybe the Chinese will vote against the resolution, hmmm?

 

[DeletedUser]

Lol, you really need to vette your sources. That blog article is without attributions or open authorship. It's just a massive bit of speculation posed by an unidentified guy named "Rob Miller," who provides no information or credentials about himself.

Anyway, here's an example of a blog article with attributions, authorship, and speculation on facts, not fabrication --- http://blogs.jta.org/politics/artic...-was-he-referring-to-wartime-joint-task-force

In summation, it indicates stronger, deeper military relations with the U.S. during The Obama administration, primarily due to efforts by Robert Gates. Economic relations is a different issue altogether and not relevant to this thread's core debate.

Carry on...

 

[DeletedUser]

Yeah, there is speculation in the article, but it's subject means that will happen. Ron Kampeas is merely telling us about something that happened on the other hand. However the Chinese are there, you can't deny that General Bingde is there. And have you noticed how many times President Obama has snubbed Israel's leaders and vice versa in response to his actions? At the least the President doesn't like them. Sure Secretary Gates was quite good at maintaining proper military commitments, but now Leon Panetta is in his place. A man who I suspect is more interested in budgetary than military concerns.

(By the way Rob is the guy who runs the blog and I think if you did some digging you'd find his credentials. But, he usually posts for an audience that has already seen a lot of his work so sometimes he assumes you can fill in the blanks.)

 

[DeletedUser]

OP Question: Israel: Why Can't The PLO Live WIth Jews?
Answer: They keep asking to, but the Jews won't let them back in.
Next.

 

[DeletedUser]

Really? I thought they were asking for their own separate nation. Now you say they want in and it's the Jews doing the discriminating?

OP Question:Israel: Why Can't The PLO Live With Jews?
Answer: They (the Jews) keep asking to, but the Palestinians won't let them in.
Next.

That's more like it.

 

[DeletedUser]

Really? I thought they were asking for their own separate nation. Now you say they want in and it's the Jews doing the discriminating?

OP Question:Israel: Why Can't The PLO Live With Jews?
Answer: They (the Jews) keep asking to, but the Palestinians won't let them in.
Next.

That's more like it.

???? What the hell are you babbling about!? Israel goes in to Palestine and Gaza at will. The only one getting in to Israel is Palestinian guest (slave) workers.
The only weapon US is trying to get banned is (not land mines or nukes) it's RPG;s.
If you kill a bunch of people on the ground with an invisible plane/drone and a missile http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gU75dB0HfvM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SK0X1L6vsIo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9-cNuUYh1o
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K43kRH5Q6wc&feature=related
And you can get a medal for it to; http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/270894-uav-operators-now-can-get-aviation-awards.html
And you behave like some F....g a.s h..e you're some kind of hero!(Rich)!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmOKo8UdLpY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QyzLu7_SiY&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yl6-ezZTlYc&feature=related
If you kill somebody with a RPG or a home made bomb you're a Terrorist!(Poor)!
Again, the people YOU consider on YOUR side You deem heroes, any on the other side is a terrorist. This "debate" leads nowhere as you are incapable to think outside the narrow, "we are always right, they always wrong", box you apparently are occupying at the moment.

 

[DeletedUser]

(By the way Rob is the guy who runs the blog and I think if you did some digging you'd find his credentials. But, he usually posts for an audience that has already seen a lot of his work so sometimes he assumes you can fill in the blanks.)

Lafitte, I consider myself somewhat of an expert at research. He goes by Robert Miller, had a heart attack in February 2010, and is married. That's all I have on him without going into obsessive-mode. No credentials anywhere, on his page or elsewhere on the net. So no, he does not provide any credentials.

As to the picture he presented, yes it was a meeting, as are all the other meetings as captured in these photos and whose initial articles arose: http://www.gov.cn/english/photoe_cw.htm

In fact, the U.S. military met with China's military just a month ago -- China-US military ties becomes more mature

Guess the U.S. Armed Forces are all chummy with China too, aye?

See, the problem here is this Rob Miller guy read a propaganda article on China's government website and speculated upon that to some even greater assumption that the U.S. and Israel associations must be dissolving. So, basically, Rob built a crap assumption based on crap propaganda. The truth is that China has become the lending capital of the world, so everyone is playing all cozy for pics to feed the propaganda machine that is China's media.

As I said, do your homework and don't believe any silly little blog that pops out with unsubstantiated speculations. Thank you for bearing with my interruption. You may all go back to your rambling.

 

[DeletedUser]

Really? I thought they were asking for their own separate nation. Now you say they want in and it's the Jews doing the discriminating?

OP Question:Israel: Why Can't The PLO Live With Jews?
Answer: They (the Jews) keep asking to, but the Palestinians won't let them in.
Next.

That's more like it.

Oh you poor, dumb sap. You obviously never heard of the Nakba.


PS (Since you answer your own question)

Troll:
One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument

 

[DeletedUser]

"Nakba"

Oh you poor, dumb sap. You obviously never heard of the Nakba.

Some of the muslims says that Nakba its when the muslims "deported" from israel .
That isnt true. muslims left Israel because they knew that the muslim countries around Israel will attack Israel in that day and they didn't want to be in Israel in that time.so they run away. And after the muslim countries lost in the war they couldn't come back.

Do you know how some of the Muslims in israel celebrated the "Nakba" this year ?
killing innocent jews !! im not saying all of the muslims did that , but many of them did/want/tried to kill !