Unfair: The Melee Dueler

DeletedUser5597

A ranged dueler doesn't have good jobs at all till he reaches to lev 45-50, melee gets a lot money and XP jobs starting with lev 5, stop whining please.:p
 

DeletedUser

Can't see the issue either. Melee duellers get a benefit from their high Vigor earlier on.

To be honest the whole melee duelling thing doesn't make that much sense to me. If I saw some dude running at me with a sword I'd shoot him. Right in the face. And that'd be an end to the matter.
 

DeletedUser

Can't see the issue either. Melee duellers get a benefit from their high Vigor earlier on.

To be honest the whole melee duelling thing doesn't make that much sense to me. If I saw some dude running at me with a sword I'd shoot him. Right in the face. And that'd be an end to the matter.

Sense?? This is The-West, where men are pantless and backpacks are infinite -- and changing your poncho changes your skills.
 

DeletedUser

lol.

First, I would like to point out that it was YOU, yogi, who picked your attributes and skills out.

Other than that, I feel sorry for you.
 

DeletedUser363

Can't see the issue either. Melee duellers get a benefit from their high Vigor earlier on.

All what I am saying is that there is an unfair balance of jobs favoring the shooter once they reach level 45-50. You can't argue with this fact. 10 out of 15 of the highest difficulty jobs require shooting, while only 2 of those require vigor. What you guys keep saying is that vigor gets better jobs earlier on. Well, then firearm duelers should get better jobs earlier on too, and vigor should get more jobs with higher difficulty to get a balance.
 

DeletedUser

They can balance jobs after they implement Hernando's gun.

LOL- I agree and what I got from reading all these posts is someone did not allocate their skills as well as they should have and want the dev's to "give" some jobs up to make up for this. Did it ever cross your mind that having a "pure" build specializing in only one area was the reason for the lack of jobs? And this is called The-West, so it makes sense that there are more high level jobs that require shooting.
 

DeletedUser363

Did it ever cross your mind that having a "pure" build specializing in only one area was the reason for the lack of jobs?
First of all, I am not a pure build in vigor. And your argument isn't making sense as my pure trapper isn't complaining about lack of good jobs.

And this is called The-West, so it makes sense that there are more high level jobs that require shooting.
The game should be balanced, not one side having better jobs at lower levels and the other having better jobs at higher levels.
 

DeletedUser

Keeping in line with what the game is called- pure trappers should have plenty of good high paying jobs- trapping was a vital skill set of the west.

Personally, I don't get why there are melee duelers in this game at all in the first place. A knife doesn't win in a gunfight.

So if you have a pure build in trapping you get good jobs- great! If you guess wrong and pick wrong or put points in the wrong locations- use the shaman. I have moved points around on my build several times and I adapt to the game I'm not asking anyone to adapt the game to me
 

DeletedUser

The game should be balanced, not one side having better jobs at lower levels and the other having better jobs at higher levels.
Why?

Most things in life involve a choice, and usually it's between an early pay off or better long term benefits.
 

DeletedUser363

Why?

Most things in life involve a choice, and usually it's between an early pay off or better long term benefits.
Why? Because this isn't real life, this is a game. A game is supposed to be balanced and not offer more advantages to one type of player.
 

DeletedUser

All in all, it is balanced, else why would there still melee duelers in top duelers of new worlds? or maybe that's just because we're just a bunch of idiots who repeats the same mistakes over and over.

what melee got as advantages:
hernando's sword (really hard to get but still best weapon and at a fairly mid stage of the game)
strenght attribute (3 duel skills in 1 attribute, ranged duelers got 2 for each attributes)

I don't have any other atm and got to go, if I think of others I will add... but even those 2 are enough to make me go as melee.
 

DeletedUser363

All in all, it is balanced, else why would there still melee duelers in top duelers of new worlds? or maybe that's just because we're just a bunch of idiots who repeats the same mistakes over and over.

what melee got as advantages:
hernando's sword (really hard to get but still best weapon and at a fairly mid stage of the game)
strenght attribute (3 duel skills in 1 attribute, ranged duelers got 2 for each attributes)

I don't have any other atm and got to go, if I think of others I will add... but even those 2 are enough to make me go as melee.

I am not saying that melee duelers are worse than firearm duelers. I am saying that more jobs are needed for both types of duelers to make the game more balanced.
 

DeletedUser

Why? Because this isn't real life, this is a game. A game is supposed to be balanced and not offer more advantages to one type of player.

Then you also want to get rid of the different bonuses for character classes as well? Oh wait I think I know what you mean....You want to change the game so it benefits one type of build, your build, never mind the fact you can change it around if you want and it was your decision. That sounds fair :laugh:

Facts are Facts: If you choose to build a character that is a melee dueler one of the sacrifices you make is that you won't have as many high luck jobs IF you devote most of your attributes and skills to help with dueling. Seems reasonable to me, melee duelers get higher powered weapons at a lower skill level than ranged duelers do and that is just the way it is.

Or you could move your skills around and create a more balanced character. :eek:hmy: (Novel idea, I know-lol)


So maybe what the dev's should do is create a "special" class to fix this? This build gives the best attribute of each class to the "special" character and that would solve everything. And what fun that would be, everybody is the same and for that matter why have these pesky skills and attributes either? Let the dev's get rid of all of it and we can all get together on-line and play checkers :laugh:
 

DeletedUser

I do see where you're coming from, but all skills are unbalanced job-wise, not just vigor vs. shooting, and it is weird how good of jobs shooting has, when vigor pretty much sucks in comparison, and two dueling skills have no jobs.
 

DeletedUser

This thread is a typhoon of bellignorance assailing an intelligent critique.

Translation of most posts here: "These go to 11."
 

One Armed Ninja

Well-Known Member
Facts are Facts: If you choose to build a character that is a melee dueler one of the sacrifices you make is that you won't have as many high luck jobs IF you devote most of your attributes and skills to help with dueling. Seems reasonable to me, melee duelers get higher powered weapons at a lower skill level than ranged duelers do and that is just the way it is.

Speak the truth man, that's only one weapon which most people have buggered themselves out of the chance of getting in some worlds

The best weapon EVERYONE can get in the game is a gun - not a melee weapon.

And at the same levels the weapons are roughly even, firearm with more precise damage ranges while melee have risks of underpowered hits so "melee duelers get higher powered weapons at a lower skill level than ranged duelers do" is a load of old nonsense, and you know it.
 

DeletedUser

Its not balanced!!! Whats the point of buying all that equipment, if you can't do any good jobs. The highest exp. jobs people with vigor can do is 42% (Picking Agaves). The people with skills in shooting can do about 10 jobs with more than 59% exp. So, while the melee duelers are stuck doing their crappy jobs, the shooting duelers will be unlocking jobs like Mercenary Work (92% money, which is higher than Silver Mining), Serving in the Army (76% exp, which is higher than picking agaves), and jobs like Charlatan and Selling Guns to Indians ( more than 50% luck). You call this balanced??

Because when all is said and done your a dueler. Why would you need more jobs if you have the best dueling equipment and weapon known to man? (on this game).

Get your exp from slapping higher leveled ranged duelers around with your plethora of fancy equipment and hernando's sword.

So picking agaves - at 7 skill points a level (vigor (1ap + 3sp) + toughness *2 (1AP) + stamina (1ap))
Can be done at level (153/7) = 22 with no equipment whatsoever.

Hunt coyotes (quickest with no equip) - at 5 per level (shooting (1ap + 3sp) + Setting traps (1ap) (141/5) = 29 with no equipment whatsoever.

That is 2 pretty balance exp jobs. Now for cash jobs.

Granite mining (17%) (52 diff) = vigor * 3 + stamina so ((4*3)+1)=13 per level giving this job at level (53/13) 5 with no equipment.

Earliest comparable payer for shooting is hunting coyotes.

Picking agaves has a cash %age of 25% compared to hunting coyotes 15%


You mentioned merc work for cash gains for a shooter and Army for exp lets have a look at these shall we. (Assuming a pure shooty/dex build)

Merc - shooting + repairing so a total of 5 points per level.

Diff 331 so:
332/5 = level 67.

Army - Shooting + Traps so again 5 points per level

Diff 298 so:
299/5 = level 60.

Both of these assume no equipment.

I really fail to see what you are complaining at. Look at the respective levels of the jobs and consider the following:

Why?

Most things in life involve a choice, and usually it's between an early pay off or better long term benefits.
 

DeletedUser

Apologies to all for the double post.

Speak the truth man, that's only one weapon which most people have buggered themselves out of the chance of getting in some worlds

The best weapon EVERYONE can get in the game is a gun - not a melee weapon.

And at the same levels the weapons are roughly even, firearm with more precise damage ranges while melee have risks of underpowered hits so "melee duelers get higher powered weapons at a lower skill level than ranged duelers do" is a load of old nonsense, and you know it.

Lets go through the levels shall we.

Level 10
Melee - Club 6-12 10
Ranged - Slingshot 6-12 10
Equal

Level 20
Melee - Push dagger 12-23 20
Ranged - shot gun 8-28 20
Equal / slightly favours melee

Level 30
Melee - Bowie knife 22-34 30
Ranged - Precise Muzzle-loader 24-36 28
equal/slightly favours ranged

Level 40
Melee - Bowie's knife 68-80 40 or Machete 10-70 40 or Sharp foil 30-54 38
Ranged - Pepperbox revolver 23-57 40 or Precise Deringer 30-54 38
Equal deringer and foil exactly the same

Level 50
Melee - Conquistador sword 48-60 50 or Hernando's sword 95-125 50
Ranged - Revolver No 1 49-57 50

I'm getting bored now. Basically this means the weapons are equal yet most melee duelers will have the cash to buy the weapon and equipment they want yet most ranged duelers will not unless they have some lucky finds.
 
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