Situation of the Game

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
We all had our ranting, complaining etc moments but I will try to be as constructive as possible here. Nothing below will be the things you don't already know though.
On a side note, I'm one of those first players that came back after a loooong hiatus, and I've talked with a lot of others.


Let's be realistic, the game has been, and still is, in Coma state for a while now, regardless of still making some money. Current player-base is just a shadow of its former-self.
But that doesn't necessarily mean it can't recover, not yet. Mostly thanks to being the only proper (browser-based) West game, in my opinion.

> Why Coma though? What's wrong?
Well it seems that the deterioration of the game started with the "Tombola sets" era. Slowly, but surely. Although lately its more like downhill, rapidly.

I mean, I understand the need of Events (or some New content, continuously) to keep the game going, and let's be realistic, we can't just expect you to stop making new sets (unless you make a permanent Classic server of sorts)

And I believe the real issues, most being related, are;
  • Power-Creep of the Sets (which is/was made even worse by the Upgrades)
  • Mechanics, Formulas, Class bonuses, Buffs etc. that can't keep up with the Power-Creep
  • NOT keeping both sides of the coin (like Melee v Ranged, FF Damagers v Tanks etc) balanced all the time
  • Town shop, even Named items, and all the chests dropping them, quest items being obsolete (that's like half, or more, of the game content poofed)
  • Frequency of Events and the endless hordes of long quests (that doesn't really give something worthy of the time spend) coming with them
  • "Day of the Dead" event itself, being the pure gamble, pay to win/lose one. Believe me, a lot of people despises it.
Then.. at the end of one's rope.. the instant-buy over-powered Nugget sets..
Job, speed etc related ones are okay-ish, somewhat, but when you get into Duel or Fort Fighting area.. and make them Upgradable on top of that.. (P2W Union Officer anyone?) it's REALLY game breaking, big time.

> On top of all these, opening new servers every year and stretching the already weak player-base too thin, then not merging/closing the "old" servers is only amplifying the issues.

Ps. Lack of "Mobile version" is also a big issue while there is a really high demand.

Ps nr2. Here, I had/have some collection of ideas (and all that) regarding FF balance issues.


This will be all for now.. Now it's up to you to decide to either let it die or help it recover its former glory.
 
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Bad Billy Jack

Well-Known Member
The problem with the game goes much deeper than this raider. I am going to add the player problem you are ignoring cuz you are a part of it.

Idaho quickly became a domination server with all the extreme nugget munchers combining into one town.

Juarez is even worse with the domination town now having TWO overflow nugget towns and they all came mainly from Idaho for a total of THREE domination town/overflow towns.

Where is the fun with you players doing this on purpose to destroy a world?

This game needs balance and the players are the biggest problem.

This is why I posted my suggestion thread to limit fort ownership https://forum.the-west.net/index.php?threads/super-alliances-must-die-to-fix-fort-fighting.58402/
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
If I am to "ignore" the personal accusations;

That's one of the consequences of the incompetent game management, not one of the causes.
I've been in other browser games too. They all tend to be like this when they become "Pay to Win" or "Pay to Progress (Faster)"

Companies are very well aware of the human nature and know very well how to use it.
I'm just trying to show that it actually hurts them in the long run.
 
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Bad Billy Jack

Well-Known Member
I am seeing far less of the "wanting good battles" balance cry of the super alliances. It is like they do not care, rather they purposelly want to destroy the game.

In the olden days we had the problem of nuggeters combining to form super towns, but the player population was much larger, diluting this problem. Also there was only so much the nuggeters could buy which you have outlined very well in your post & previous posts, raider. Nowadays the nuggeters know no bounds especially with the upgrade of nugget sets.

Those old people now populate "old" worlds like Colorado and actually care about the health of the game. The nuggeters in the new worlds apparently do not so we need inno's help.

The only solution I see is for inno to force the breakup of these super nugget alliances by limiting the number of forts they can own.
 

lulumcnoob

Well-Known Member
Yes, nuggeters tend to congregate in one place because they are competitive in nature - we saw that early on in idaho and I have to take your word for World J. There was also in Idaho's case an alliance set up with the intention to directly counter the nugget alliance using experience and skill, but the nature of humans (along with an innovative new fort battle unbalancing policy) lead to great difficulties, and too many sides unwilling to work together to save battles. Now I don't think theres a solution for Idaho as I've come to know the nature of the particular humans in leadership there, it's very different from Colorado as you said Billy.

Ultimately the game worlds' populations are far too low and the player base too spread out for pvp battles to function properly. The only solution I can see is trying to consolidate the player base into somewhere already highly rated for battles, or somewhere on the precipice of being able to hold decent fights, but lack regular fort fighting players.
None of that will matter unless some of the issues Raider mentioned are fixed though, and I have completely given up on trying that at this point, so my remaining efforts will be about extending what we have, before it degrades much further and should be considered as a casino to gamble for pixelated sets, rather than a browser game.
:lovetw: (but down with tombola simulator)
 
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RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Not like filled battles lead to any competitive/challenging battle. With an Avg Lead of Attackers, they always end with slaughter.

Like, the first filled Medium battle I've seen in ages (Well Defense lacks 4 ppl but still)
Result: 29 Attackers fell, 80 Defenders fell (Aka "All Defenders have been defeated") ..

Just another consequence for ya.
 
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lulumcnoob

Well-Known Member
Attacks have been known to be OP when filled for years, I believe there were even plans to equalise the numbers of attack and defence that were seemingly scrapped around the time we stopped caring about not destroying battle balance with out of control tombola set strength.
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Not like this though. It's just insanity at this point.

And I've actually witnessed "good" Defense battles where defenders actually were able to keep two towers & and a wall or two via swaps on Idaho.
Until the genius "invention" of Union Officer madness of course. (Which also means without Livingston or Nugget Bear)

I guess that was kinda thanks to national Alliances being mainly Hp builds (Duelers even) though.
As we all know sadly .Net is all about making more and more Damage. Mainly thanks to the issues I've listed above, including human nature.
Apparently too many actual Positive projects have been scrapped.
"Promised" Adventurer & Soldier class rework anyone?
 
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Poker Alice

Active Member
We all had our ranting, complaining etc moments but I will try to be as constructive as possible here. Nothing below will be the things you don't already know though.
On a side note, I'm one of those first players that came back after a loooong hiatus, and I've talked with a lot of others.


Let's be realistic, the game has been, and still is, in Coma state for a while now, regardless of still making some money. Current player-base is just a shadow of its former-self.
But that doesn't necessarily mean it can't recover, not yet. Mostly thanks to being the only proper (browser-based) West game, in my opinion.

> Why Coma though? What's wrong?
Well it seems that the deterioration of the game started with the "Tombola sets" era. Slowly, but surely. Although lately its more like downhill, rapidly.

I mean, I understand the need of Events (or some New content, continuously) to keep the game going, and let's be realistic, we can't just expect you to stop making new sets (unless you make a permanent Classic server of sorts)

And I believe the real issues, most being related, are;
  • Power-Creep of the Sets (which is/was made even worse by the Upgrades)
  • Mechanics, Formulas, Class bonuses, Buffs etc. that can't keep up with the Power-Creep
  • NOT keeping both sides of the coin (like Melee v Ranged, FF Damagers v Tanks etc) balanced all the time
  • Town shop, even Named items, and all the chests dropping them being obsolete (that's like half, or more, of the game content poofed)
  • Frequency of Events and the endless hordes of long quests (that doesn't really give something worthy of the time spend) coming with them
  • "Day of the Dead" event itself, being the pure gamble, pay to win/lose one. Believe me, a lot of people despises it.
Then.. at the end of one's rope.. the instant-buy over-powered Nugget sets..
Job, speed etc related ones are okay-ish, somewhat, but when you get into Duel or Fort Fighting area.. and make them Upgradable on top of that.. (P2W Union Officer anyone?) it's REALLY game breaking, big time.

> On top of all these, opening new servers every year and stretching the already weak player-base too thin, then not merging/closing the "old" servers is only amplifying the issues.


This will be all for now.. Now it's up to you to decide to either let it die or help it recover its former glory.
 

SaiyajiN BEAST

Well-Known Member
They doesn't care about the community inno cares only about money and make more events and new items at shop with nuggets it' simple you pay money in game you will be good if you will not pay you will be a little kid versus nuggets players
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Another thing they don't seem to realise is, majority of the already small "consistent" / "loyal" Player-base is still the "Old" Veterans, since they don't bother to Advertise this game of theirs anymore (instead, they advertise their other games in this very game, wth!)

And with all the issues mentioned above, game has been dumbed-down a lot which almost made the competitiveness, experience and knowledge that has been gathered over the years by those people obsolete. If you know what I mean.
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Shhh, in this topic we all pretend like they don't know anything


On a side but still important note, seems I've forgotten to mention the lack of "Mobile version" issue even though there is a really high demand.
As far as I know, this is the only game that they don't have one.
 
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Bucksnort Hawkins

I'm here to attest, from experience, that no matter what you say, how you say it, in any form, to whomever you think at Inno or its parent company you are addressing this issue(s) to; nothing is going to change.

Don't waste your time.
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
I mean, ironically the Facebook page of the game is much more active than here.. They even ask for Feedback time to time for the sake of asking :'P
(Of course they don't neglect to Advertise their other games there either)

Other than that everyone just gave up trying on Forums since it goes in one ear and out the other.
 
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Bucksnort Hawkins

I have to do this as I am a fatal optimist. Here is my take on Raider's OP that I am sending to etriel in an email:


I. The creation of over-powered sets in general that has been "creeping" slowly in all areas of the game including fort fighting, dueling, working/farming, and even travel sets. This is made more problematic with upgrading. This issue has several repercussions:

i. The game's general mechanics and formulas including class formulas, Store buffs, etc. cannot keep up with the increasing unchecked "creep" of these new sets.
ii. The game balance with dueling and fort fighting is greatly impacted because dynamics like melee versus ranged duelers and damaged-based builds versus tank-based builds in fort fighting are remarkably inequitable.
iii. Regular town-based gear has become almost completely obsolete except for the brief period of a new world's opening few weeks before the Christmas tombola. The subsequent issue there is these same items are dropping from common chests that are still included in tombola drops i.e. Steel lined box or Fancy chest.
iv. Finally, and the most poignant problem, Innogames is providing very potent purchasable sets i.e. the Union Officer set which is making the original issue of this point even worse. This is setting a terrible precedent as well with purchasable sets.

You noted in your last response that the Courtier set and the R. Livingston set were meant to counter-balance the Union Officer set. Many players can verify that these sets do not achieve that function at all.

II. There is some concern in regards to the volume of quests and the severity of the requirements in contrast to the time restrictions, in some cases. The other main concern is the reward factor of many of these quests is not equitable. need examples

III. Finally, there should be a mobile version of The West as other Innogames seem to have. This would certainly attract more users and maybe be a catalyst for creating an updated version of the game in general; a reason to approach problem solving on a lot of these issues hopefully.


Please feel free to comment, critique, etc. as this is my very last attempt and trying to communicate this issue. I left out the comment on the frequency of tombolas. I do not think that can be changed at all. I have the same feelings about addressing the format of the DotD event. That game format is obviously purposeful as a tandem tactic of opening a new world to generate revenue. Again, not something that can really be cited by players; it's just how they make money.

EDIT: Should a point be included about entertaining server merges? If so, should it just be a suggested consideration or should we provide specifics?

Thank you.
 
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RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
I. The creation of over-powered sets
Let's not start with calling OP and use "Tombola" sets instead, or use both :'P
iii. Regular town-based gear has become almost completely obsolete (..)
Let's emphasize that, this issue cut-off about half or more of the actual game content (and turned into a Tombola simulator) !! Town shops, and the items sold there meant much more than just Quest items.
Of course then there is Named/Shiny items dropping from jobs or chests that were also made obsolete.
I left out the comment on the frequency of tombolas. I do not think that can be changed at all. I have the same feelings about addressing the format of the DotD event. That game format is obviously purposeful as a tandem tactic of opening a new world to generate revenue. Again, not something that can really be cited by players; it's just how they make money.
Well yes but especially this year Oktoberfest and DotD was almost connected (or whatever its called) and that's crazy & tiring, even for Nuggeters.
Then there are those clicky clicky events some people complain of but I think they are fine. Purely free rewards anyway.
iv. Finally, and the most poignant problem, Innogames is providing very potent purchasable AND UPGRADABLE sets
If they stay out of Forts and Duels with those insta-buy OP nugget gear would be great.. But being realistic.. I'd be happy enough if they won't be Upgradable.
Unless they are auctionable and "OK" stuff like Lucille Lasso etc that can also be gotten (collected?) via Quests.
(God forbid things like Union being auctionable!)

> We probably can ignore the quests part.. That's kinda secondary issue. Some ppl does them no matter what anyway :'P

> Mobile version is CRUCIAL. There is really high demand.
Html5 helped A LOT but that's not enough on its own.

> Of servers I believe they are being monitored but feels like they don't realise the need of migration/merging, somehow?
I mean.. Fort battles on those are enough of a proof on its own.. But if they think few people still playing and giving money is more important in the long run.. what can we say to that Inno-competence?

Oh.. then there is so-called Beta server(s).. that was/were made practically useless..


Step by step.. The way they messed up.. Slowly, but surely..
I mean, even if they really listen us, by some miracle.. Nothing will happen right away. I will take baby steps over no-positive steps at all.
 
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