New set with hiding

chydovish4e

Member
West needs a set with HP and hiding
The defense is very strong in cortina, Captain is not enough to beat cortina in defense
It is necessary that mostly people also get shot, for this you need a good set with HP and a hiding, as an alternative to cortina
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
They should (have) just add minimal Hiding to Cortina, instead of dividing FF sets "Attack set" "Defense set" ..
It only increases the "Premium" gap
While we still have a set like Union Officer that is best for both Offense and Defense.
Captain is not enough to beat cortina in defense
That is wrong though. It's still the same cheesy Damage and weak Resistance formula in play.
On same height (Ground vs Ground, Tower vs Tower etc), Damagers still rule.
Don't judge from Kansas experiences. Just you wait for Damagers to reach Level 150 :roll:


But sure, Defenses have the upper hand when Adventurers are used well.
 
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Bill Paxton

Active Member
Just think about it. In the past there was a hp tank set and a damage set. Now there is an ff attack damage set and a ff defense hp defense set. Of course they will soon sell us opposite version of both. More overpowered sets means more tombolas with strong sets means more money for them.
 

CBenney

Member
I don't think it is the sets problem but when they changed the tower and distance factor it has stacked all the good perks for defense since they move first. Even if you was balanced defense will win due to those issues since defense can dictate again and contain attack unlike what we used too. I think they should trial putting numbers back to what they was or try something bold like swapping defense for attack in movement and shoot order but that is just my opinion.
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
it has stacked all the good perks for defense
All? Number advantage, focus firing still a thing.

But sure, now Adventurers and their blocks are even more crucial (yet they ain't rewarded for nothing) and Defenders move first.
I don't think it is the sets problem
On same height (Ground vs Ground, Tower vs Tower etc), Damagers still rule.
So it's not the Set itself. But.. there should've been some Hiding in Cortina set.
I mean Tanks have even less hit ratios now, yet hit for even less Damage than before.

Meanwhile Damagers still have way too much Damage, and still decent Hit Ratio, unless u can support urself with Distance, somehow.
And, "All-in-Hp" still favors Soldiers.

So I'd rather fix such issues via Formulas first, then think of re-balancing the rest.
Maybe.. https://forum.beta.the-west.net/ind...ttles-adventures-and-duelling.3619/post-38400

I mean I'd be worried if our Defending Tanks were regularly surviving 200+ shoots (with Dodges) on a competent Server..
But that's not the case.
 

CBenney

Member
your picking out one set but that set will not be here in a few months or a year it be something else with more issues but the games system don't work because attack can't move. Main reason is HP has gone past the line that most toons can take a round or few on towers or most other sectors so movement is stopped. However I agree damage has also gone past the line that is should be but least damagers can be on both sides just one has towers bonus that is why i said why not try attack goes first and shoots first will help movement and defense will have to gamble on points so chance early kills can happen.
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Yea I already mentioned the Hp thing on various places and Inno doesn't want "too-much-Hp" to be viable either.
Although, Damages also "limitless" since there is not even a soft-cap on Formula.

These both (and some other issues) need Formula changes, and we tested one or two, yet they had flaws which weren't fixed, instead, Formulas were scrapped.

I believe the dumb decision of increasing the Max Character Level also has a blame in this though.


As for Structures etc.. Attack bonuses are a tad too much.
Well, for Damagers at least..
 
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luminiscous

New Member
I think cortina is very strong at the moment. Because of that people have lost interest into coming to the attacking part at any side. Of course people will lose interest if defense is winning or offense needs to play perfect in order to win(pretty impossible for everyone to listen to FF Leader instructions). Something needs to be done asap for the offensive side at least. Let's not forget the bonuses tanks receive from sitting at their tower as well.
 

lulumcnoob

Well-Known Member
Personally I think it's ironic that people will "stop coming to attacks" like you all forgot what the game and defences were like right before Cortina - and afaik defence tanks still don't hit too much, especially advents. On top of this it's a new world where no one is max level yet, so your players are competing with premium gaps, level differences and no counter set to cortina yet for the average content.
We have all been spoiled by the damager's monopoly on fun and the instant satisfaction of a tombola dopamine hit.

You know fine well what new worlds are. Just wait for the newest OP set that swings too far in the particular direction you like, and then spend a lot of nuggets on it.
Maybe wait longer for formula changes to actually fix the game and make it fun and fair again. Or play on a stable world where a new set doesn't absolutely destroy PvP, because if you'll remember, this set was a direct response to the easily-obtainable damager sets and the fact defences couldn't win battles.
I'm sure in time there will be a specific tank set for attacks, like you say in the OP.

Look at it this way, it's a chance to build your forts while the game catches up on its own power creep, and the rest of the content in the game closes the premium gap - by levelling up to compete with the elite players. New worlds go from 0 to 100 overnight when a tombola hits.... and then it takes a year to catch up. And we keep perpetuating it.
 
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RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Tanks on ground (no structure) sucks even more now, period. (17 hits 32 misses as Worker with 170+ Atk :roll:)
While Damagers do well on every type of sector. And absurdly high Hit Ratios on Towers.

If Cortina was to be strong on ground against real (no-Hp) Damagers, then sure..
But it's not. It barely is "decent" with Towers.

The issue is though.. Soldiers get the best of it, because of Hp bonuses.
Game just doesn't penalise "Everything in Hp" and doesn't encourage/reward "mid-Range" Hp. (& Rewards no-Hp too much)

That alone needs 2 Formulas to change.
 
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RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Meh, Soldier Tanks rock and others struggle as usual, although they are a bit better now..

Resistance difference between 15k Hp and 30k is 10 (TEN) at best.
Dodginess of Workers can't make it up (& they can't really do more Damage anymore) .. and Adventurers.. well.. you know..
I mean.. Adventurers are extremely important like the good ol' days but they ain't rewarded at all. The irony.. :lol:


Check here for reference:
And see that we don't have extraordinary Dodges and stuff.
 
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cpt.N3M0

Well-Known Member
Damn raider !
You didnt studied the band pass filter ?
All of this has a solution just apply the theory ,
this is a great game it just need few player friendly modifications!
I am pro cortina but against tank damage negation!
 

Bill Paxton

Active Member
Sorry, this thread is HILARIOUS. Tanks finally get a set approaching decent and all the OP damagers are complaining. Guess what? You guys got all the good stuff for years. Deal with it.
Are "OP damagers" aka duellers even complaining? HP sets benefit them since their crits hit hard no matter how much hp a tank has. So like people above already mentioned, HP and dueller crits (10% / 20% of HP) scale well, while ff dodge and hit chance doesn't grow flat. The more points you put into them the weaker is the effect of the next skillpoint.
Seems to me that mainly workers and adventurers got nerfed by this set.

And don't forget that some people switch classes. Yesterdays tank might be todays damager ;)
 

Bill Paxton

Active Member
I don't think it is the sets problem but when they changed the tower and distance factor it has stacked all the good perks for defense since they move first.
I think it's both. Before most hp soldiers would just skill hp and little to no ff dodging. So the increased tower buffs didn't affect them much. Now there is a strong hp set that also gives a good amount of ff dodging skills, which turns them into fortresses when sitting on a tower.
Best thing is they didn't even have to bother with how to skill :) A bit like duellers putting everything into leadership :>
 

RaiderTr

Well-Known Member
Soldiers and Duelers are still the favored Classes of everything. (Except Building, but OP Tombola sets allow that for everyone)

Ironically, Soldiers make great Duelers thanks to Hp and Tactics, and Duelers make great FF'ers thanks to absurd Damages and ever-increasing Critics.
Having said that, Soldiers make the most reliable Tanks of FFs as well. Simply because of the RNG independent Class bonus: Hp.

Like I said above:
Resistance difference between 15k Hp and 30k is 10 (TEN) at best.
Dodginess of Workers can't make it up (& they can't really do more Damage anymore) .. and Adventurers.. well.. you know..

The tested formulas were aimed to lower the efficiency of "All-in-Hp" and "All-in-Leadership" but sadly they got cancelled.

And now all Inno plans is, Level 200 and "NEW QUESTS & ACHIEVEMENTS" as their "BIG PLANS" of 2020 2021