Luap Nor

[DeletedUser]

I was talking about Luap Nor!

sorry my mistake:sad::sad::sad::sad:

 

[Diggo11]

A point of note: I didn't create this thread nor ask for it to be created.

I agree with the logic of your analogy, Denisero, but disagree that it applies to me. My posts are not dangerous, except perhaps to errors. Having been a member of dozens of discussion forums over the last couple of decades, I've got plenty of experience from which to assess that. Given the rough-and-tumble nature of the game this forum exists to support, it's even less tenable. But, again, it's up to the owners and moderators to decide what they want, and I'll abide by that even if it seems absurd to me.

To extend your speeding analogy a bit... how fast is too fast? 1 MPH? 10? 30? How long do people have in which to slow down after entering a slower speed zone? Those are fuzzy metrics IRL, and there are similar fuzzy edges to the rules here -- edges which I somehow can't seem to locate properly, and which seem to be so restrictive that they impinge on ordinary conversation. I could provide examples, but only at the cost of opening up a public challenge to the moderators here, which I refuse to do.

Since I can't comprehend the real rules (the enforcement, as distinct from the stated rules), it's easier IMO just to not post any more and spare myself and everyone else the hassle. I'll just take a cab or travel another route. Sadly, this is the only road to the official discussions about TW, but there's nothing to be done about that.

To bk200: you have a higher tolerance for this stuff than I do, it seems. Either that or you don't know how to use the URL field in your browser yet. :laugh:

I second this.

Well since it seems you haven't quit the forums this thread is pointless isn't it? Quitting means you don't come back or do you need a definition of that.

Look Luap, I think you over reacted, this thread is a joke and the mods have a right to interpret the rules as they see fit. If someone doesn't like how they are being interpreted then they certainly have the choice not to participate in the forums. The forums are a bonus, not a necessity nor a right. You can compare all the forums you want to this one, but this forum is the one that matters at the moment.

There are a couple of things I know about you. 1. You are smart, 2. You say what you want when you want, 3. You have a sense of humor. I don't believe you when you say you can't comprehend the rules. 99% of the participants in this forum have no problem comprehending the rules. You certainly are smart enough not to fall into the 1% that can't comprehend basic common sense.

You want to cast blame on everyone but yourself when there is no reason to cast blame anywhere. If you really need someone to blame then blame yourself. You chose to continue with behavior that started to get you in trouble. You then decided you could not live by the rules and left the board. I think that lasted 12 hours? Anyways, the rules haven't changed, only the efficiency at which they are being enforced. So if you can't deal with it then you can't deal with it. Leave. Quit coming back and posting about how unfair everything is. It is not unfair. You were not judged any more harshly than anyone else contributing on these forums. If anything I believe you were given several warnings when they could have been infractions because you were a good contributor to the boards. You were probably shown more leniency than others might have been shown. So cry a river somewhere else about unfairness.

Be fair, I made this thread. If people are leaving because of forum rules the mods have an issue; consumer sovereignty.

I think the rules are displayed unclearly. I've recieved two infractions over rules I've never heard about until I got the infraction.
How can you punish someone for a rule they've never heard about? I'm not complaining about the staff, just think the rules could be displasyed clearer.

Have you read the sig rule? Absolute joke! Have they heard of grammar?

So the problem is with the moderators and only in the last couple of weeks. Now think. What has changed in the last couple of weeks. The only thing I know of is that Elmyr and Violette became mods.

Obviously Luap is one to break them or he wouldn't be getting warnings and infractions. I highly doubt the mods go around giving people warnings and infractions just because it is a Tuesday. So either he broke them or you are intimating that the mods have a personal grudge against Luap.

I'm glad no one wants to start a war with the mods but the comments left in this thread seem to at least be taking pot shots at them. As Luap even said, if he doesn't like how the boards are moderated he can go somewhere else, has stated he is leaving, and has only to not come back to fulfill this statement.

Thank you Luap. That is right. Mods are volunteers. They don't do the job for the glory or the adoration of the user base. They do it because they love the game and the forums and know enough about the game and forum rules that they are seen as a benefit to the team.

More digs at the mods. I don't care if it has a smiley face. I'm sure at least a few people have been stabbed in the back by a smiling attacker.

So now Gem is the only qualified mod? More attacks on the mods. Nice going.

You disagree about what? That you were a speeder? It was an analogy Luap. The entire point of it was that more mods mean that people that break the rules will get caught faster and more often. If you could explain why that shouldn't apply to you I'd like to hear it. Either you broke the rules or the mods are out to get you. If it is the former then that would be your personal responsibility to change your behavior. If it is the latter then say so. I highly doubt it is the latter.

So while this thread is full of 'don't want to start a war' comments, it actually infact does attack the mods. Specifically, in my opinion, the mods that were brought on board in the last couple of weeks.

I am not trying to drive Luap's departure date up. He already stated several times apparently to several people that he was done with the boards. Apparently that was not entirely true. Let's just get the real reasons he is leaving clearly stated. He has a problem with the new mods because he has received warnings/infractions in the last couple of weeks. So again I say, either he broke the rules or he feels the mods have a personal vendetta against him.

Now I suppose he can reassert that he feels there are 'gray areas' since the rules have been revised and that is why he is being warned/infracted. I can say from personal experience that I haven't had a problem with any gray areas at all. I'm sure the bulk of the people responding to this thread haven't had an increase in warnings/infractions in the last couple of weeks. This is not because the mods are too busy finding ways to infract Luap, it is because those players don't seem to have a problem with any gray areas. These gray areas are just another way to shift away from personal responsibility and lay blame at the mods feet. The way I read it this thread lays the blame at the new mods feet. That to me is unfair and petty.

I'm not attacking the mods themselves, they are good volunteers and our fellow acquaintances. I am attacking the modding, aka the rules they must enforce. They are obviously told to interpret them far differently to how I do, which isn't surprising given the quality and readability of the rules.

Funny how you are the master of one line insults and jabs on the forum yet your feelings were hurt when Diggo made a comment about you in jest.

Ok the thing I posted was kinda harsh, but I knew that normally Luap would take it lightly as a joke. He had every right to complain.

But alot of those quotes don't directly attack the person in a manner that violates the rules. For example insulting "noobs" in general (not directed at anyone in any way) could not be deemed violating the rules or being offensive. Also to post may criticize their knowledge, but it isn't a personal attack; he doesn't swear or directly call them stupid.


For all those who question this thread I will say I'm in a bad mood, and this news just made it worse. And hey I'm just loyal, hate to see anyone leave. Especially since it was the administration as the pushing force, who are meant to have a higher value to consumers. But perhaps I will see reason once I relax as I've finished my extra work, but for now I stand by my position.

 

[DeletedUser]

Bye bye Luap a great person who had been the member of this moded Forum

 

[Diggo11]

PS. Denisero someone (not me) told Luap this existed so he thought he may as well read it... he probably wasn't expecting such a ramble.

 

[DeletedUser]

^ well i am not that person i SWEAR

 

[DeletedUser5046]

Bye bye Luap a great person who had been the member of this moded Forum

every forum have moderators BK...

@diggo...probably luap just read it from te latest posted thread....i dun think luap would go for off topic threads as i see his someone who is fond of development and IBF section...so as wit te world and saloon..but not off topic and campfire stories.

 

[DeletedUser]

I stand by my position that this thread has turned into an attack on the mods. Oh, you aren't attacking the mods themselves because you haven't named names. I think your "Bring Gem back" comment was as good as naming names Diggo. It's not the mods but how they are modding? Guess what Diggo, that is the mods by definition. Split hairs all you want. All anyone has to do is read the posts here and they can see mods are being made to look like either they don't know what they are doing or that they are picking on someone.

That's the last I have to say on it. You guys can continue complaining all you want. The rules are the rules and the mods are here to interpret them and keep order on the board. Luap wants to leave because things have changed then so be it. It is a shame but it is not a tragedy. The boards will go on, the game will continue and in two weeks no one is really going to care one way or the other.

 

[DeletedUser]

To borrow an analogy from the other "back seat modder", I'll use the speeding one too...

There are highways around here that are wide open, no curves, no towns, and few crossroads. I hate the fact that the speed limit is only 55 mph on them when it would be safe to drive faster, but I don't hate the highway patrol who stop people and give them tickets for speeding.

I also hate wearing seat belts, waiting 10 minutes for a light to change when there is no other traffic, and a few other laws I have to follow. If I didn't think I could obey the laws as they're enforced, I'd most likely stop driving rather than continually get tickets. I believe that's what Luap Nor was saying about his reason for not wanting to post anymore.

I don't know any patrolman who would consider it a personal attack if I said that I hate the speed limits in rural areas, and I would hope that none of the mods feel attacked because of someone not liking the rules here.

 

[DeletedUser]

Unbelievable.

Denisero: those comments you quoted from me (about noobiness, etc.) were taken out of context by you to place here in your ongoing quest to prove whatever it is you believe about me -- which is wrong; I've already explained where I'm coming from (as much as possible with the restrictions we all have to deal with regarding forum moderation), and I am the master of my own mind, not you.

I invite everyone to go read each of those quotes in context and see for yourself what I meant by them. (The "50% less noobiness" one, in particular, was simply a parody of a light beer commercial; the "your" in that one was rhetorical, for crying out loud.)

It's obvious you're not going to listen to me about me, so there's no point going on. Your mistaken beliefs about me trump anything I say, in your mind. It's like talking to the government: anything I say can and will be used against me, facts, logic, and reality be damned. My best option in talking with you is just not to. :sad:

After as long as we've spent conversing, I'm disappointed and personally offended at the level of disrespect and contempt you show for me here, to put it mildly. It can't do anything other than bog this thread down in interpersonal strife, and it is a major relief to have excised it from my day (other than this last thread, which will soon end). No doubt you have your reasons for wading into this thread, and I don't question them per se, but in pursuing those goals, you've become obnoxiously convinced of some things which are not so. But to argue into the details of those things, we'd have to crack open the Pandora's box of moderator activities, and I'm not going to do that even though I'm confident I could make a good case for my PoV in doing so -- and no, that is not a dig at the moderators; you must take that statement in the context of everything I have said in this thread. I'd rather just let you wave your wand of judgement on me and insist to everyone that I'm off base, as much as it's not in my nature to stand by and do that.

I just hope that IRL you're more willing to apologize to people and accept what they say than you seem to me, and I further hope that someone else can get through your recalcitrance where I've been unable to.

And for whatever my own failings have been, in that, I once again apologize. I know I can be a real mule when it comes to arguing, and can certainly cause my own share of offense in the process. It has not been my intent to do so and I hope I can be forgiven for it. The last thing I'd want to do is hurt any of you (including Denisero), and if it feels otherwise, please accept that that is only a result of how things have gone, and is not coming from my heart. It is quite exasperating to be prosecuted in this way, especially when I've made every attempt to not take things in that direction w/r to individual moderators, which is what I'm being falsely accused of secretly wanting to do. Please don't let my temporary exasperation eclipse who I am, to you. I'm just me.

 

[DeletedUser]

This is becoming ridiculous.

There are no hard or hurt or angry feelings between Luap Nor and the moderation team. Luap Nor is not at fault for deciding where he will be happiest spending his time, and the moderators are not at fault for doing their jobs as best as they are able. If the two sides being discussed in this thread like each other and can treat each other with mutual respect, perhaps everybody else should take that example.

 

[DeletedUser]

Who ever gave those mods the power to infract? In loving memory of Luap Nor :sad:

From Diggo's signature. If that isn't a slap in the face to the mods I don't know what is. I think this thread is trying to make Luap out like he has been crucified by the mods. Whether Luap did that himself or not it doesn't matter. This thread steps over the line. I'm not a big fan of 'poor me' or 'look what those nasty mods have done now' sentiments. Luap didn't start this thread, that is true. He most likely would have gone quietly if it had not been started. I really don't have anything personal against you Luap, I just don't like where this thread is going or why it was started. If you can't get that then I don't know what to tell you.

Those comments were not taken out of context. Those are your entire posts. They were not helpful to the conversation and I'm sure the people they were directed at probably felt put off and insulted by your comments. If we are talking about feelings, specifically Luap's feelings, then I felt it was appropriate to show that maybe Luap didn't think about others feelings as well. I'm guilty of it at times, I admit it. I just don't get in a huff about it and blame others when I get as good as I gave.
​

 

[Diggo11]

I stand by my position that this thread has turned into an attack on the mods. Oh, you aren't attacking the mods themselves because you haven't named names. I think your "Bring Gem back" comment was as good as naming names Diggo. It's not the mods but how they are modding? Guess what Diggo, that is the mods by definition. Split hairs all you want. All anyone has to do is read the posts here and they can see mods are being made to look like either they don't know what they are doing or that they are picking on someone.

This is becoming ridiculous.

There are no hard or hurt or angry feelings between Luap Nor and the moderation team. Luap Nor is not at fault for deciding where he will be happiest spending his time, and the moderators are not at fault for doing their jobs as best as they are able. If the two sides being discussed in this thread like each other and can treat each other with mutual respect, perhaps everybody else should take that example.

Denisero the mods (noun) are a great group of volunteers. They are people we know and are friendly with, I have no criticism against them. Its the modding (verb) I'm against. The mods must enforce the rules, and frankly the rules are ridiculous, not necessarily all the content but how poorly they are written and clarified. Basically put it this way, if you are caught "speeding" and 50Km/h (30mph?) do you you blame the police enforcing the law or the laws they are enforcing? I'd say the latter. Let me reassure you when I say modding I mean what they are enforcing, not the mods themselves. If you take that outside the intended meaning that is your fault, as I have already explained the intended meaning.

And to the bring back Gem/down with speed cams. Before I continue I must point out the more mods = more modding post. I doubt they are going to change the rules, so if having less mods on duty would effectively do the same then I would support it. Simple as that, nothing against the mods, just the only other way around to not changing the rules.

Violette I believe the anger and passion in this thread has lead to many distorted views and stupid comments posted out of anger. I think we can fairly say we all support the mods, but for me (and probably Luap) I can say I just don't like the job they are asked to do. End of story.

 

[Diggo11]

From Diggo's signature.

That I fully apologise for. Under normal circumstances I wouldn't have attacked the mods, but I was stressed and angry at the time. We all do stupid things when under pressure, I'm only human just like the rest of us. So again no offence to anyone here and I'm awfully sorry.

 

[Diggo11]

Sorry for the double post, but I think this debate has concluded and it's time for a lock (Elymr may you do the honours?). I wish Luap farewell and hope everyone has enjoyed his presence. BTW may no-one leave with any discontent, Luap and I are known for heated arguments and hold no grudges against you. And apologies to any offence taken by mods, at the end of the day you're our friends just doing a job I disapprove of, but doing that job well.

 

[DeletedUser]

I agree the thread has gone somewhere unhelpful. No argument there. In hindsight, I think it would have been better if Diggo and I had either not talked at all or talked at more length, but we had no way of knowing that then.

Now, Denise: The comments were indeed taken out of context, since you only posted what I said, not what led to it, and by compiling only those lines taken out of their various conversations, a false impression was created. I already pointed out one example where you left the meaning behind and turned an innocent one-liner parodying a commercial into something entirely different -- something I never meant and would never say in that way. What do you want, me to stop everything and defend myself point by point from all these false charges you like to bring? Why?? I won't. Waste your own time.

Stop prosecuting me. I know what I said, because I said it. I don't need you to regurgitate it for me out of context. Had any of those people been offended, they could have said so without you. They didn't. OTOH, I am offended by your tactics here, and have already told you so directly. Result? More of the same. I may as well be talking to a doorknob.

Whatever it is you're trying to do to me, you should do it to yourself instead.

I still love you, under it all, but I don't like you when you do this. It's too much like... me, when I get annoying. :dry:

 

[DeletedUser]

Violette I believe the anger and passion in this thread has lead to many distorted views and stupid comments posted out of anger. I think we can fairly say we all support the mods, but for me (and probably Luap) I can say I just don't like the job they are asked to do.

That's a very fair statement.

 

[DeletedUser]

Before I continue I must point out the more mods = more modding post.

Oh obviously the less mods we have the safer everyone will be. That is like saying the less sex education someone gets the less likely they are to get an STD. Puh-lease.

I'm sorry it came to this too. I think Diggo has been an unreasonable twit in this thread. Denying it is an attack on the mods and then making his signature a direct attack on the mods.

I think Luap doesn't understand the concept of quitting. You certainly have posted a lot since you quit. Maybe you meant to give a 2 weeks notice first.

I still love you, under it all, but I don't like you when you do this. It's too much like... me, when I get annoying. :dry:

Yes, it is isn't it. Sucks to be on that end as you have now seen.

 

[DeletedUser]

Locked at the request of the OP.

 

[DeletedUser]

May I just put a note, regrettably I had not seen this escalate at the time, that if you have a problem with a moderator please PM them rather than creating threads. Failing to do that, or if you do not feel comfortable PM me and explain the situation. We're all human.

This is in no way blaming the OP, or Luap, just a simple reminder. I don't like threads like these at all