Has Obama broken his promises and betrayed the people?

DeletedUser16008

In continuation of my saying Obama has betrayed the American people, both Black and otherwise.

lol your funny people especially HS but seeing as you asked.

http://video.msnbc.msn.com/the-ed-show/43071536#43071536

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zOh7KTWeMo&feature=player_embedded#!

http://patriotupdate.com/6084/obamas-broken-promise-ill-help-jobless-blacks

http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/06/barack_obama_and_the_betrayal_of_black_america.html

http://www.newsmax.com/BenStein/Stein-Obama-campaign-promises/2011/08/12/id/407115

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/oct/27/watchdog-obamas-list-kept-promises-stretch/

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/04/05/the-top-five-campaign-promises-obama-left-behind/

Just a selection that took 2 mins im sure theres loads more.

Also its not just Obama hes just the latest patsy, I would call Bush Jnr nothing less than a mass murderer and war criminal of the very highest order, second only to his horrendous father Bush Snr. In fact the whole Bush family are nothing but criminals and should be locked up.

So no I dont rate your political stooges over the last 20 years they all serve the same masters.

As usual HS is trying to paint me as something im not im just pointing out the clown Obama Bin Laden ( the worlds greatest current terrorist leader, yes I said it the US political leadership are just a bunch terrorists ) was voted in because of his race AND promise of "change" which was only possible due to his racial background weather you like it or not.

The whole world was aware of this except apparently you.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/11/04/reactions-around-the-worl_n_141187.html

The world is still aware but the shine has come off somewhat and hes now seen as nothing but just another political liar and a puppet to many who had real faith in this guy....and thats the real sad part, he had a chance no one else has had in decades but he had no intention of ever living up to his promises in the first place, words for votes was all it ever was and all it will ever be. Its a game played out every 4 years and the last one sucked in almost everyone. Your idiots that actually think your supporting anything but the lobbyists and those that fund both sides simultaneously ? yeesh politically black, white, purple or brown, dosnt matter they all dance to the same tune and paymasters.

Any political figures in the US that impress me ? mmmmm Ron Paul for his honesty and integrity, and nope I have no clue what party he represents nor do i care, hes at least clued up to what really goes on and not afraid to say it. Unfortunately hes also a top candidate for assassination if he ever gets to the top if i ever saw one.

"Pats Hells on the head and passes him his lullaby book to go back to sleep with"

Im not american and nope my country politics are no better either but at least I don't pretend they are, conservative,labour,liberal, socialist, democrat, communist,Nationalist bahhh a plague on all their houses.

We are at the brink of war yet again, Iran or Syria im not sure which but its one or the other if not both.... do you even have a real clue as to why ? I mean really have a clue ?
 

DeletedUser

So you do not think, even for a moment, that just maybe, possibly, that Obama was voted in because he WAS BETTER THAN THE ALTERNATIVE?
 

DeletedUser16008

iggyberto said:
So you do not think, even for a moment, that just maybe, possibly, that Obama was voted in because he WAS BETTER THAN THE ALTERNATIVE?
Click to expand...

Undoubtedly better youd think huh ? hmmm lets see now.How many wars has Mr Change got the US out of since becoming president as promised ?

Troops still in Afghanistan
Troops still in Iraq

Yup thats right ZERO. Not to mention

Bombing Libya
Bombing Yemen
Bombing Pakistan

Guantunamo bay etc and all other interrogation sites still open. etc etc yea hes a real saint.

Seems like it was if anything a choice of tweedle dumb or tweedle dumber ? nice choice hes managed to even top old Bushy and thats saying something...... same thing just packaged slightly differently to the masses and they bought it hook line and sinker.

By the way just how does someone with this record get the Nobel peace prize ?? :blink:
 

DeletedUser

Why do we think the president has all of this power when he actually doesn't? He has to work with Congress, which has quite a bit of nut-jobs.....
 

DeletedUser

As usual, Victor, you're full of crap. In the mere three years in office as U.S. President, Obama has fulfilled all these promises:

  1. Extend child tax credits and marriage-penalty fixes
  2. Create an Advanced Manufacturing Fund to invest in peer-reviewed manufacturing processes
  3. Increase minority access to capital
  4. Require economic justification for tax changes
  5. Implement "Women Owned Business" contracting program
  6. Change standards for determining broadband access
  7. Create a consumer-friendly credit card rating system
  8. Establish a credit card bill of rights
  9. Expand loan programs for small businesses
  10. Extend the Bush tax cuts for lower incomes
  11. Extend and index the 2007 Alternative Minimum Tax patch
  12. Close the "doughnut hole" in Medicare prescription drug plan
  13. Expand the Senior Corps volunteer program
  14. Require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions
  15. Give tax credits to those who need help to pay health premiums
  16. Require large employers to contribute to a national health plan
  17. Require children to have health insurance coverage
  18. Expand eligibility for Medicaid
  19. Expand eligibility for State Children's Health Insurance Fund (SCHIP)
  20. Require health plans to disclose how much of the premium goes to patient care
  21. Establish an independent health institute to provide accurate and objective information
  22. In non-competitive markets, force insurers to pay out a reasonable share of their premiums for patient care
  23. Eliminate the higher subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans
  24. Expand funding to train primary care providers and public health practitioners
  25. Increase funding to expand community based prevention programs
  26. Reinstate executive order to hire an additional 100,000 federal employees with disabilities within five years.
  27. Create a best practices list for private businesses in accommodating workers with disabilities
  28. Launch educational initiative for employers on tax benefits of hiring employees with disabilities
  29. Increase the Veterans Administration budget to recruit and retain more mental health professionals
  30. Fully fund the Veterans Administration
  31. Assure that the Veterans Administration budget is prepared as 'must-pass' legislation
  32. Expand the Veterans Administration's number of "centers of excellence" in specialty care
  33. Expand housing vouchers program for homeless veterans
  34. Appoint a special adviser to the president on violence against women
  35. Fully fund the Violence Against Women Act
  36. Direct military leaders to end war in Iraq
  37. Begin removing combat brigades from Iraq
  38. No permanent bases in Iraq
  39. Send two additional brigades to Afghanistan
  40. Increase the size of the Army and Marine Corps
  41. Increase special operations forces and civil affairs
  42. Create a military families advisory board
  43. End the "Stop-loss" program of forcing troops to stay in service beyond their expected commitments
  44. Strengthen and expand military exchange programs with other countries
  45. Make greater investment in advanced military air technology
  46. End the abuse of supplemental budgets for war
  47. Make U.S. military aid to Pakistan conditional on anti-terror efforts
  48. Open "America Houses" in Islamic cities around the globe
  49. Give a speech at a major Islamic forum in the first 100 days of his administration
  50. End the use of torture
  51. Allocate Homeland Security funding according to risk
  52. Create a real National Infrastructure Protection Plan
  53. Increase funding for local emergency planning
  54. Seek verifiable reductions in nuclear stockpiles
  55. Extend monitoring and verification provisions of the START I Treaty
  56. Stand down nuclear forces to be reduced under the Moscow Treaty
  57. Organize successful Nonproliferation Treaty (NPT) Review Conference in 2010
  58. Appoint a White House Coordinator for Nuclear Security
  59. Expand federal bioforensics program for tracking biological weapons
  60. Initiate a grant and training program for law enforcement to deter cyber crime
  61. Improve relations with Turkey, and its relations with Iraqi Kurds
  62. Launch an international Add Value to Agriculture Initiative (AVTA)
  63. Create a rapid response fund for emerging democracies
  64. Grant Americans unrestricted rights to visit family and send money to Cuba
  65. Restore funding for the Byrne Justice Assistance Grant (Byrne/JAG) program
  66. Establish an Energy Partnership for the Americas
  67. Expand the Nurse-Family Partnership to all low-income, first-time mothers
  68. Release presidential records (in a timely manner)
  69. Require new hires to sign a form affirming their hiring was not due to political affiliation or contributions.
  70. Provide affordable, high-quality child care
  71. Reform No Child Left Behind
  72. Recruit math and science degree graduates to the teaching profession
  73. Reduce subsidies to private student lenders and protect student borrowers
  74. Encourage water-conservation efforts in the West
  75. Increase funding for national parks and forests
  76. Increase funding for the Land and Water Conservation Fund
  77. Encourage farmers to use more renewable energy and be more energy efficient
  78. Expand Pell grants for low-income students
  79. Create a community college partnership program
  80. Pursue a wildfire management plan
  81. Remove more brush, small trees and vegetation that fuel wildfires
  82. More controlled burns to reduce wildfires
  83. Expand access to places to hunt and fish
  84. Push for enactment of Matthew Shepard Act, which expands hate crime law to include sexual orientation and other factors
  85. Repeal "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy
  86. Restore funding to the EEOC and the U.S. Department of Labor's Office of Federal Contract Compliance Programs
  87. Reform mandatory minimum sentences
  88. Create a White House Office on Urban Policy
  89. Fully fund the Community Development Block Grant (CDBG)
  90. Establish program to convert manufacturing centers into clean technology leaders
  91. Establish 'Promise Neighborhoods' for areas of concentrated poverty
  92. Create an artist corps for schools
  93. Champion the importance of arts education
  94. Support increased funding for the NEA
  95. Promote cultural diplomacy
  96. Add another Space Shuttle flight
  97. Use the private sector to improve spaceflight
  98. Work with international allies on space station
  99. Partner to enhance the potential of the International Space Station
  100. Use the International Space Station for fundamental biological and physical research
  101. Explore whether International Space Station can operate after 2016
  102. Conduct robust research and development on future space missions
  103. Increase spending to prepare for longer space missions
  104. Work toward deploying a global climate change research and monitoring system
  105. Enhance earth mapping
  106. Appoint an assistant to the president for science and technology policy
  107. Support commercial access to space
  108. Establish school programs to highlight space and science achievements
  109. Strengthen the levees in New Orleans
  110. Establish special crime programs for the New Orleans area
  111. Rebuild schools in New Orleans
  112. Fund a major expansion of AmeriCorps
  113. Create a Social Investment Fund Network
  114. Bolster the military's ability to speak different languages
  115. Appoint the nation's first Chief Technology Officer
  116. Provide grants to early-career researchers
  117. Protect American intellectual property abroad
  118. Reform the patent system
  119. Increase efforts to reduce unintended pregnancy
  120. Work to overturn Ledbetter vs. Goodyear
  121. Stop the development of new nuclear weapons
  122. Create a national declassification center
  123. Appoint an American Indian policy adviser
  124. Create new financial regulations
  125. Increase funding for land-grant colleges
  126. Ban lobbyist gifts to executive employees
  127. Sign a "universal" health care bill
  128. Create new criminal penalties for mortgage fraud
  129. Require 10 percent renewable energy by 2012
  130. Release oil from Strategic Petroleum Reserve
  131. Raise fuel economy standards
  132. Invest in all types of alternative energy
  133. Enact tax credit for consumers for plug-in hybrid cars
  134. Ask people and businesses to conserve electricity
  135. Require more energy-efficient appliances
  136. Create a 'Green Vet Initiative' to promote environmental jobs for veterans
  137. Create job training programs for clean technologies
  138. Require states to provide incentives for utilities to reduce energy consumption
  139. Support high-speed rail
  140. Support airline service in small towns
  141. Invest in public transportation
  142. Equalize tax breaks for driving and public transit
  143. Consider "smart growth" in transportation funding
  144. Will seek more accommodations of bicycles and pedestrians
  145. Help states and localities address sprawl
  146. Share enviromental technology with other countries
  147. Double federal spending for research on clean fuels
  148. Provide grants to encourage energy-efficient building codes
  149. Increase funding for the Environmental Protection Agency
  150. Get his daughters a puppy
  151. Appoint at least one Republican to the cabinet
  152. Fully fund federal contribution to the preservation of the Everglades
  153. Raise the small business investment expensing limit to $250,000 through the end of 2009
  154. Extend unemployment insurance benefits and temporarily suspend taxes on these benefits
  155. Support network neutrality on the Internet
  156. Reverse restrictions on stem cell research
  157. Reproductive health care will be "at the heart" of health care reform
  158. Kill bin Laden
In stark contrast, the GOP has fulfilled a mere 9 promises.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/gop-pledge-o-meter/

Oh, and bye, hehe
 

DeletedUser16008

Hehe, the usual spin.

According to your own list there you forgot to lay out the rest of the facts on the very same site

506 specific promises Mr. Obama made during his victorious presidential campaign has so far fulfilled only 158, or roughly 30 percent awwww 30% thats heroic i must say given that a lot on the list are debatable to say the least and pretty silly yet claim they are some big achievement. ?

Ill highlight just one debatable claim on your list 50. End the use of torture.... sorry but this one screams BS at me. Oh and one silly promise 150. Get his daughters a puppy I mean DUDE wtf ? lol

Hey thats a pretty big number lets say that again 348 unfulfilled promises out of 506, dosnt sound or look so cool now does it ? you want me to go ahead and number them and make your list look pathetic ?

Its really amusing that just because im attacking Obama youd think I support the republicans.Do I care about GOP ? nope not at all ... ill spell it out for you again as your having trouble getting it. the partys all dance to the same tune and paymasters.

I suspect your inferring I have an interest in GOP I'll say it again because I mentioned ron Paul, I have no political interest in either party.The only politician I have ever heard making any sense at all in the US is Ron Paul, then again i take that with a pinch of salt too as promises of change dont happen do they ? Although I must say hes been at it for years and hasnt changed his tune so seems to me hes certainly credible and been elected over and over again in the past 40 years.....more than the last few chumps in the whitehouse i must say. Id vote for the guy if only on the premise its unlikely to be as bloody as this clowns term.

I don't see you refuting any of the big murderous broken promises there honey, you must be tired because id be a little bit more concerned about the elephant in the room rather than the gnats.
 
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DeletedUser

Ok, you seem to be very good at looking at Hellstroms post but seem to lack in answering mine! Who was the alternative to Obama? Do you really think they would have made more progress? Are you even an American or are you just venting your views from some other country? How old are you, and, do you really even care about US politics or, rather, do you care more about thrashing the current state of political activity in the US instead of actually offering something better as an alternative? Do you even vote? Do you understand what it is to be President of the USA?

I have many questions for you before I even get into an actual debate with you.
 

DeletedUser16008

iggyberto said:
Ok, you seem to be very good at looking at Hellstroms post but seem to lack in answering mine! Who was the alternative to Obama? Do you really think they would have made more progress? Are you even an American or are you just venting your views from some other country? How old are you, and, do you really even care about US politics or, rather, do you care more about thrashing the current state of political activity in the US instead of actually offering something better as an alternative? Do you even vote? Do you understand what it is to be President of the USA?

I have many questions for you before I even get into an actual debate with you.
Click to expand...

I answered your question already, they all answer to the same corrupt self serving lobbyists its no mystery or secret. So no it matters not a jot whos in its all irrelevant. I've already stated im no american or love of the political system there, or in my own country either. US politics are simply a theatre and have been for decades ( like many others ) and im no party lover so no im not going to try to suggest an alternative because it simply dosnt matter in the current set up. Yes I do vote, no its not anyone's business how i vote.

Look i have no magic bullet to fix things there other than it starts with people at the ground level when they have had enough, what I won't put up with is all the theatre and preening and ridiculous lies put out when the bottom line is its all a game to them, they don't care about you, they just don't. People like Hellstromm would rather you subscribe to the mainstream brainwashed view that you must stay within the current box created and choose one of the two mainstream options... woohoo how quaint....do you see anything remotely fair about a two horse race when both are run by the same owner ? Id rather people just start to drill down below the surface a bit and see for themselves how one sided the whole thing really is.

And naaa i don't care what label you put on me, i question them all anyway, its in my nature and if one or two people decide "hmmm maybe ill take a look around a bit " then good ive succeeded in at least making someone stop and think for themselves. Of course Hellstromm would just rather everyone see a lot of links the occasional related research paper and end their curiosity there, well don't its how things got where they are atm....don't take what I say as red go and look for yourself and make your own mind up, but for godsake especially apply it to people like Hellstromm too who can only see it as they have been taught/conditioned, look around you, they sure don't have the answer and are in fact part of the problem.
 

DeletedUser

The American Election of Obama was highly popular in Canada. In fact more than 60% of Canadians would have voted for Obama if they could! That's popularity.

As for the fact he only achieved 30% of his promises... well, that's a large number, lol. Most of the Senate is against him I believe and many of them have contacts with various lobbyists.

In my opinion, the American political system is hopelessly screwed and skewed towards people (mainly men) with deep pockets. Obama's funding was mainly from the less fortunate. First American politician to have contributions made via internet.

Still, trying to achieve his promises is better than many other politicians in the world can say.
 

DeletedUser

Gad, why did you have to start this debate. Makes it so hard for me to make a clean exit.

Ah well, Victor you're seriously being ridiculous, intentionally avoiding reading any of the facts and instead burying yourself in propaganda blogs loaded with misinformation and outright fabrications. The links I provided for you are not from some spincasters, unlike the links you provided.

Anyway, of the 500+ promises that Obama made (and yes, that's a buttload more promises made "and" delivered than ANY other U.S. President in history, do a factcheck on that one and you'll see I'm right), here's the breakdown:

158 completed
49 compromised but nonetheless completed
179 in progress
67 stalled (GOP filibusters, endless Congressional loop committees, etc)
53 broken promises

Iraq
Only instructors exist in Iraq at the moment. Regardless, all remaining U.S. troops will be out of Iraq by December 31, 2011. This was a joint agreement made between the U.S. and Iraqi government. And Victor, the U.S. military stayed as long as they did in Iraq, in one form or another,by the request of the presiding Iraqi government.

Afghanistan
Your sources are incorrect. Obama indicated he was going to get U.S. troops relocated from Iraq and into Afghanistan, where the attention should have been all along. As it is, he fulfilled the obligation of neutralizing Osama Bin Ladin, and the bulk of the Al Qaeda leadership, which is why they have sped up their plans to exit from Afghanistan, and are redirecting their efforts to train Afghani military and police (as they have done in Iraq).

I've covered enough of this here and in previous forum debates. I'll leave the rest of the community to point out all your other glaringly incorrect assertions.

Really, I'm out now. Bye and everyone have a good time.
 

DeletedUser16008

Hellstromm said:
Gad, why did you have to start this debate. Makes it so hard for me to make a clean exit.

Hehe, or as Michael Corleone said : Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in.:D

Ah well, Victor you're seriously being ridiculous, intentionally avoiding reading any of the facts and instead burying yourself in propaganda blogs loaded with misinformation and outright fabrications. The links I provided for you are not from some spincasters, unlike the links you provided.

Oh i was going to use that link in my first post no problem, but there you go again trying to establish one publication is above question when others you don't like have to be the rouges, really HS you should know better, just because a media tool is said to be worthy dosnt make it so... i mean look at Fox news or CNN ? no better than backroom bar gossip a lot of the time or do you suppose the enquirer magazine is a credible publication too ? oldest spin in the book your sources are all bad mine are all right because the Gov uses them ... naaaa sorry old son dosnt wash with me.

Anyway, of the 500+ promises that Obama made (and yes, that's a buttload more promises made "and" delivered than ANY other U.S. President in history, do a factcheck on that one and you'll see I'm right), here's the breakdown:

158 completed
49 compromised but nonetheless completed
179 in progress
67 stalled (GOP filibusters, endless Congressional loop committees, etc)
53 broken promises

Ohhh ive read the list youd better believe it, and heres what it is a lot of, issues still pending from other administrations to be claimed as their own achievement with a good many pathetic ones added to be ticked off. Id say fully half or more completed have nothing whatsoever to do with his administration but were in progress anyway and as for putting in dumb promises such as.

150 Get his daughters a puppy
151 Appoint at least one Republican to the cabinet

Well you can see the quality of ridiculous promises that are added in there, im surprised hes not included his xmas card to do list, or 507. pick up a loaf of bread etc seriously any idiot can make a list of pointless promises and claim its more than any other for a few Brownie points. The key words here are national importance and substance they are the promises worth keeping first, not the silly minor ones they are frankly embarrassing. So please don't try to sell me hes got a bigger things to do list ticked off than any other so he must be the best because its glaringly obvious to anyone with half a brain its mostly propaganda BS

Iraq
Only instructors exist in Iraq at the moment. Regardless, all remaining U.S. troops will be out of Iraq by December 31, 2011. This was a joint agreement made between the U.S. and Iraqi government. And Victor, the U.S. military stayed as long as they did in Iraq, in one form or another,by the request of the presiding Iraqi government.

OK now your just talking rubbish and are sounding like that class A orifice Cheney. Currently, about 45,000 US troops are in Iraq. And all are instructors ? :blink: errr ok lets just rename all troops in Iraq Instructors shall we ? All 45,000 of them. Nothing less than blatant lies and dont turn the "but they asked us to stay" water taps on, it dosnt alter the promise has not been kept, you go to war and must have an exit strategy prior to engagement, no excuse.

Afghanistan
Your sources are incorrect. Obama indicated he was going to get U.S. troops relocated from Iraq and into Afghanistan, where the attention should have been all along. As it is, he fulfilled the obligation of neutralizing Osama Bin Ladin, and the bulk of the Al Qaeda leadership, which is why they have sped up their plans to exit from Afghanistan, and are redirecting their efforts to train Afghani military and police (as they have done in Iraq).

My sources on Afghanistan are incorrect ? All i said was they are still currently engaged in hostilities ie war I dont believe i provided anything more so you must be dreaming there or are you trying to say those facts are wrong ?

I've covered enough of this here and in previous forum debates. I'll leave the rest of the community to point out all your other glaringly incorrect assertions.

Oh I do hope so

Really, I'm out now. Bye and everyone have a good time.
Click to expand...

Lastly all the best HS I hope your writings go well and if you are ever published please send me a copy id love to review it :p

Take care bud.
 

DeletedUser

Really Vic, I reckon EVERY President has made electoral promises that they did or could not deliver. I'm thinking especially of Wilson & Roosevelt who were both elected on the promise that they would not involve the US in European wars.
So, yes, every US President ever has probably 'betrayed' the American people.
Doesn't get you very far, does it?
 

DeletedUser16008

Eli Makepeace said:
Really Vic, I reckon EVERY President has made electoral promises that they did or could not deliver. I'm thinking especially of Wilson & Roosevelt who were both elected on the promise that they would not involve the US in European wars.
So, yes, every US President ever has probably 'betrayed' the American people.
Doesn't get you very far, does it?
Click to expand...

Absolutely agree Eli, no different im sure nor over here, what I can't abide is the blatant lying just to get the vote and happily sending its men to die for nothing but a doller or pint of oil, its criminal.. I know people will say ahhh they all do it etc ... the thing is these people are supposed to be the ultimate in responsibility leading a nation. They harp on about the young not being this or that, point fingers at other nations and generally do anything but practise what they preach and send people off to die not to mention the others killed all in the name of the military industrial financial complex. On top of that people stand up for them because they seem to accept its ok to lie and deceive murder and torture etc and I find that appalling.

These people are supposed to be worthy and although im not expecting them to be saints it would be cool if they could just stop flapping their mouths and whoring themselves for a vote when they have no intention of keeping their word. So no im not saying Obama is any different but heck that guy spent all his campaign on promising "Change" so yea he's the man in the seat and hes the one breaking the promises atm so tough if sometimes people like me come along and point out how full of BS he actually is.

Sad thing is I fully expect to see he's still around next time looking at the patsy alternative and i doubt very much if Ron Paul will be allowed to get to the main opposition running position as hes just not going to suck up to the scumbag moneymen like the others.

oh and the reason it dosnt get people far ? they put up with it and 99.9% stay quite and accept it. Not good enough IMO
 
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DeletedUser

Well, we can all direct our disapproval at political leaders, bankers, murderers, estate agents, motorists, hippies, jews, non-jews, liberals, librarians, freemasons, vegetarians, christians, rastafarians, nudists .....in fact, anybody at all.

That's the easy bit.

Almost nobody bothers proposing a coherent, constructive alternative.

Because that's the hard bit.

The world of internet forums seems full of hatred-venters and short on solution-providers.

Let's start from the premiss of the thread - Obama disappoints. Is it because he is dishonest? If it is, how would you enforce an honesty test on prospective candidates? Or is the problem with democracy itself? Or the lobbying system, or the military-industrial complex, or social disparity, or neo-colonialism or the Pax Americana or, or, or.......

All I've heard from you Vic is "Ron Paul"!
That's it?
That's your fix?
roflmao :D
 

DeletedUser16008

Eli Makepeace said:
Well, we can all direct our disapproval at political leaders, bankers, murderers, estate agents, motorists, hippies, jews, non-jews, liberals, librarians, freemasons, vegetarians, christians, rastafarians, nudists .....in fact, anybody at all.

That's the easy bit.

Almost nobody bothers proposing a coherent, constructive alternative.

Because that's the hard bit.

The world of internet forums seems full of hatred-venters and short on solution-providers.

Let's start from the premiss of the thread - Obama disappoints. Is it because he is dishonest? If it is, how would you enforce an honesty test on prospective candidates? Or is the problem with democracy itself? Or the lobbying system, or the military-industrial complex, or social disparity, or neo-colonialism or the Pax Americana or, or, or.......

All I've heard from you Vic is "Ron Paul"!
That's it?
That's your fix?
roflmao :D
Click to expand...

Y'see ?

The minute anything is said as something other than the usual corrupt options the ridicule begins..

Just what is so bad with This Ron Paul ? from what I see and hear the guys more credible and truthful ( at least on the surface ) than all the rest. Could he do worse ? I mean actually worse ? yet you just laugh. I don't find where the US is atm in the slightest bit funny, the foreign policies or irresponsibility and reputation they have, financially bankrupt & considered by a huge % of the planet to be nothing but bullys in fact its something to be no less than ashamed of and you laugh at me for suggesting a guy with an honest track record to date as an option ? okayyyy :rolleyes:

Tell you what Eli start a new thread. I'll give plenty of answers, options, alternatives etc. starting at the very beginning, with Honesty and Integrity. There might be no magic bullet but there an awful lot of better options and choices and answers than the ones being employed atm.

You have just demonstrated people want an answer to everything when all it takes is a tiny tiny effort from everyone to start to turn things around.

When was the last time you signed a petition, helped someone in trouble you dont know, went to a protest, checked where your money went, helped an old lady with her shopping , gave the person in your street a lift when you passed them, spoke out in public, bought local produce, walked to the shops instead of using the car, said good morning to the same person you see every day on the street and asked their name, worked for free for a day. In short made a difference no matter how small ? A million things to do too numerous to mention and all doable by normal people.

In fact I think ill start a thread on exactly what youve mentioned, there are solutions, plenty. Most people will not entertain them being far too selfish at the moment and thats the mindset that needs changing, it wont be easy but I promise you one thing. When you start dealing with the small things the bigger problems start to become smaller too. When people start caring about themselves, what they do and respecting others then you realise when you hurt another you harm yourself. Once thats realised there is no way unless mentally unstable you are going to harm yourself and THAT is the road to a better world.

Mr Lennon coined it dacades ago in a song everyone knows " all you need is Love" Dosn't matter how silly it may sound, it happens to be true. Think about it ;)
 

DeletedUser

Would this be the same Ron Paul as you are talking about?

Paul’s alliance with neo-Confederates helps explain the views his newsletters have long espoused on race. Take, for instance, a special issue of the Ron Paul Political Report,published in June 1992, dedicated to explaining the Los Angeles riots of that year. “Order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks three days after rioting began,” read one typical passage. According to the newsletter, the looting was a natural byproduct of government indulging the black community with “‘civil rights,’ quotas, mandated hiring preferences, set-asides for government contracts, gerrymandered voting districts, black bureaucracies, black mayors, black curricula in schools, black tv shows, black tv anchors, hate crime laws, and public humiliation for anyone who dares question the black agenda.” It also denounced “the media” for believing that “America’s number one need is an unlimited white checking account for underclass blacks.”…

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So your solution is a combination of Ron Paul and "love"?
Hmmmmmmm......
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DeletedUser16008

Eli Makepeace said:
Would this be the same Ron Paul as you are talking about?

Paul’s alliance with neo-Confederates helps explain the views his newsletters have long espoused on race. Take, for instance, a special issue of the Ron Paul Political Report,published in June 1992, dedicated to explaining the Los Angeles riots of that year. “Order was only restored in L.A. when it came time for the blacks to pick up their welfare checks three days after rioting began,” read one typical passage. According to the newsletter, the looting was a natural byproduct of government indulging the black community with “‘civil rights,’ quotas, mandated hiring preferences, set-asides for government contracts, gerrymandered voting districts, black bureaucracies, black mayors, black curricula in schools, black tv shows, black tv anchors, hate crime laws, and public humiliation for anyone who dares question the black agenda.” It also denounced “the media” for believing that “America’s number one need is an unlimited white checking account for underclass blacks.”…

​
So your solution is a combination of Ron Paul and "love"?
Hmmmmmmm......
​
Click to expand...

I don't know Eli is it ? a report 20 years old, id have to read it in its entirety and its entirely possible it has a point ive no idea. I do know hes been around a heck of a long time and for someone with such a record in politics there will be a mass of stuff to throw up no doubt, what does impress me is hes been saying the same thing for a decade or more about whats coming, why, and the solution in part. Im not a republican nor a democrat but i am wiling to bet this guy has a lot more honesty and integrity than most others, certainly he sticks to his guns regardless. Thats to be admired surely

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_positions_of_Ron_Paul I don't have a problem with those views mostly hes run twice for president and been reelected countless times to his state, looks pretty solid a political career guy to me and not jumping from sponsor to sponsor. I dunno he just strikes me as a straight forward guy with brains for a change.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fHfdSi-GDo&feature=related brilliant speech & totally aware of what is really going on.

Now if your saying Ron Paul is a racist ? well im not aware if he is or isnt ... hes certainly not a war monger or willing to spend what dosnt exist just for the popularity vote like most others do... Id rather deal with an honest racist than a dishonest liar because they usually are far far worse.

Btw ive yet to meet anyone who isnt at some point in some form or other a racist.People use the word all the time just for effect and to scare and boy does it work. For instance its fine to be minority aware and give special dispensation but at the same time is it right that minority should be put above others ? its a might bit confusing that in the main, certain areas can use the racist card yet others cannot... the very fact I have been tagged with it by HS here makes me laugh, yet does anyone even know my race or background ? nope but they assume im white. Very easy to assume ones a racist if the color is white yet my experience tells me racism exists everywhere in all forms and colors.
 
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DeletedUser

Just because someone calls you a racist it does not mean they assume you are white. That being said, if you can name 1 honest politician, other than honest Abe, then you are probably mistaken. As far as Obama not fulfilling promises I believe you must have no idea how American government works. Obama doesn't even really have that much power, if you really want to get down to it. He has at least tried to make good on every single one of his promises. The problem is that the senate and congress have done their best to block him at every turn. Why? not because they had valid reasons, or better ideas, but simply just to throw a monkey wrench in the process. I will not thrash Obama because in reality he has done so much more than Bush Jr that it is not even funny. The other thing you may miss is that most of the bad things that have happened this term are residual effects from Bush Jrs horrible terms. If Obama gets re-elected then we can start to see more of what he has really done and what he is going to do.
 

DeletedUser

Hear, hear Iggy.
All politicians lie (well, maybe not Jimmy Carter). You don't get to high office without being able to play a close hand. Frankly, I don't much care. Bill Clinton was an egregious liar but still made an effective and popular president. If he'd been allowed a shot at it he'd probably have got a third term. We're allowed to elect and re-elect known liars and cheats though - it's called democracy. It's a terrrible system, but unfortunately all the alternatives are even worse.:D
 
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