Dueling system - old and easily abusable

kispera

New Member
Hello,

Following up on recent events, leading up to https://forum.the-west.net/index.ph...ted-duel-farming-practices.62182/#post-810545 , I am sharing my thoughts.

This system, where we have our 'regular' level, which awards skill and attribute points, and our 'dueling' level, which is something tied to 'dueling experience' gained or lost obtainable only by winning/losing duels, creates big gaps in actual dueling power between players.
So big, to the point where a duel can be initiated between two players where the difference between their 'regular' levels can be as high as 100+. That is more than 400 skill points. On top of that, we have clothes and sets scaling with 'regular' level. So the gap increases even more.
In short, a player can be 'regular' level 100, with dueling level 200+, and can challenge a player with 'regular' level 200 who never dueled (OR simply reset his dueling level). Sure, once that level 200 starts dueling a bit, his level will increase fast (well the same goes for anyone, the curb of dueling level raises fast at the beginning and slower towards the end) and you can say he will be 'out of reach' for the 'little' player.

But that not does much in terms of winning chances. The small player, in reality, has little to no chance of winning because of scaling items and difference in skill points.

On top of that, experience gained during duels is way higher than any other 'repeatable' activities in the game.

Example:
Player1: level 169-duel level 390
Player2: level 240-duel level 280.

Player 2 challenges Player 1 in full experience clothes - no actual dueling items (what I mean by that, Player 2 is using items like 'western' , 'reaper' and other combinations with little to no 'aiming', 'dodging' , 'shotting' etc. while Player 1 uses a full 'Hunter' set. The result will be crushing and overwhelming in favor to Player 2 AND Player2 gains 41k experience.
This duel is never 'fair' or 'balanced', and by that I mean Player1 has no chance of winning. In spite of that, Player2 gains a ton of experience. The game encourages Player2 to stomp Player1 again and again.
The only 2 options Player1 has to 'save' itself are:
-self KO- not allowed by game rules AND a form of intentionally submitting
-raising its HP as much as possible to prevent KO from Player2, and 'feeding' XP unintentionally to Player2 (as much as 41k as in the example above)

Abusing this system is easy, as shown by real circumstances and it's happening.

I highly urge a change. Something to actually encourage players into 'fair' dueling and 'fair' contest. Similar to real fighting sports where a weight categories exist: a person weighing 120KG cannot fight a person weighing 65 KG.

Suggestions:
1) make dueling clothes scale only with dueling level
2) complete revamp of the dueling systems


List could go on forever...

I want to make a strong point on how easily this system can be abused for experience gain. Be it either by people intentionally losing or by virtually having no chance of winning.
Personally, I am close to quit dueling, after investing a lot of time and resources into clothes and learning curve of how duels work. By the time I finally understood the mechanics, I am highly disappointed and mostly frustrated dueling rather than having a remotely fun experience.
 
You won a speed server in dueling and now all of the sudden you're a grandmaster.
Jokes aside, I agree that the system is not perfect. Resetting the duel level indeed results into this (level 220 character with level 220 trashing level 160 character with 300 duel level). I see you're at the receiving end of the same situation that I am in. And although I shouldn't complain as the mechanics work in my favor (basically everything in this game favors the higher level player) I would like to see a change. I didn't give it much thought yet so I am not seeing an easy to implement change that would solve this (other than, maybe, decouple character XP from duel XP completely), but the scaling of gear with duel level is an interesting idea (and it's not unheard of: soldiers gain a bonus of tactics only in duels, so I guess having your gear scaling adjusted to your duel level is feasible). I'd like to see this on a different server (like beta, or a speed world) to see it in action.
Until then, my profile picture accurately describes the situation.
 
kispera said:
Suggestions:
1) make dueling clothes scale only with dueling level
2) complete revamp of the dueling systems
Click to expand...
I just quote this 2.

1. I will not agree with this, level 120 going to level 450 or whatever level, and have the same clothes or attribute points same as someone who is level 190 and level 450 or same level.
2. They revamp the FF 1 time in how many years, 13-14 years? And what happened, if I remember they revamped after IFBC3 after attackers cleared out defenders every FF. Now they release after 2 years same sets, better than previous but they balance with the tanks sets. So I am not expecting them doing that, but it will be well received if will happen.
 
If duels were based on the character level instead of the duel level it would make more sense now since everything is level based and upgradable to lvl5.

Other than that i cant see a fair duel happening often these days and defending gets harder and harder. You can still beat someone 50levels above of course if you know how but even some noob can beat you just because of higher level.
 
Maybe an idea would be the stats given by duel clothes to be capped, despite of duel or character level. This way, the duels will be decided based only on the skill, knowledge and spec of each player, instead of the character level gap.
 
"DUELING" is not even the proper description of the attack. A "duel" would be a mutual combat with both parties agreeing to the contest. The current duel structure is actually a "Bushwack", to use the original cowboy term.

Changing the game to include both the mutually agreed duels, where one player openly challenges another (and the points are greater) and the bushwack, where points and rewards are lower, would be more period relevant.
 
1 suggestion i have is to put a regular level cap between duels so dispite duel level , a player 200 lvl can not duel a level 100 player but then a new problem comes..this game has small player data base and at some points you may not be able to find over 3-4 players to duel throw your day..a solution to that would be to add NPCs to the game that are duelable and unkillabe and make them swap gear randomly every 10 min or so..also no1 mention the rollback potion. i think rollback potion needs a rework. for example make it cost 100-150 nuggets or bonds and make it have 1 month cooldown instead of 6... wait 1 year of my life to use 2 rollbacks? really? this is unacceptable.
 
also i forgot to mention the 450 duel lvl cap..its very low..imagive a lvl 240 regular lvl to wait 6 months for a rollback and then in 3 days be back at 450 what he gona do the rest 175 days? make duel lvl cap to 800 or instead of need 1k xp from lvl 1 to lvl 2 make it 10k or more in need.
 
The correct thing would be for the amount of experience needed to level up in duels to be the same as the normal level. You gain 1k experience in duels and gain 3 levels, that's wrong. It should be based on at least half your current level. If I need 5 million experience points to level up, I would need 2.5 million to level up in duels. But this won't amount to anything, so stop complaining and accept it. I'm 80 levels below the top duelist and I can still beat him. Do items and levels help? Intelligence too.
 
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