Duel Changes

DeletedUser35120

Max hit of 3x weapon damage is rather old. Resistance used to be able to reduce damage to 0 and the max bonus was +100% (2x multiplier). That's what allowed a max hit of 3x weapon damage on a headshot (at the time max hit was 345 with a precise buntline). Later on, max resistance became 50/75% and a few updates later max damage bonus became +75% as well.

Any chance that ticket is an old one? Before 2.0 even?

The 3x formula is way old and 2.625x is current formula cause there have been duels in Dakota with Boone's Axe that has never resulted over 670 damage in one shot. ..it's there in a no.of morticians. While with a GT, I've done no more than 656 with over 200 tries. So yea, going by the 1.75 x 1.5 x max damage of weapon formula, those values are just perfect. And Dakota came with v2 just for the sake of information to whomever concerned. So either the ticket is old.. or it's just new and giving wrong information (Again, no offence to anyone, mistakes do happen).

Now if there's a change with v2.28 (Yet to arrive) where the damage multiplier has been changed again, then I don't know..
 
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DeletedUser36979

It hasn't even been released yet :p

But it has, both on net and beta. 2.28 just ups it to 10% along with a few minor things, while it is new on national servers.

Also Diggo11, as the Wiki Ranger, you should get the national wiki's updated, some of them haven't been updated in years, which might give people the idea that the developers have given up...
And according to changelog/versionlog the game is currently running 2.04 :p
 
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DeletedUser32747

Max hit of 3x weapon damage is rather old. Resistance used to be able to reduce damage to 0 and the max bonus was +100% (2x multiplier). That's what allowed a max hit of 3x weapon damage on a headshot (at the time max hit was 345 with a precise buntline). Later on, max resistance became 50/75% and a few updates later max damage bonus became +75% as well.

Any chance that ticket is an old one? Before 2.0 even?

The support ticket i referred to is less than 3 months old by 1 day, meaning tomorrow will be 3 months to the day that that response was sent.


http://prntscr.com/866chj

Also, notice that it is a "senior marshal" that responded, as i had a regular mod turn it over to someone who knew what they were talking about.
Funny how the general player thinks they know better than the people who are TAUGHT to deal with all the questions, with CORRECT responses, to prevent extra support tickets. I am not trying to be rude.

If you think i am lying about damage, check some of the morticians in the top towns of briscoe. Those high values in the 600-800+ damage have been put in those morticians in the last 6 months.
I myself have done 683 on headshots with a ranged weapon.

http://prntscr.com/866iv9 town with 813 in the mortician. I have seen the duel reports, and 813 damage was against a FULL resist dueler :D
 
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DeletedUser35120

If you think i am lying about damage, check some of the morticians in the top towns of briscoe. Those high values in the 600-800+ damage have been put in those morticians in the last 6 months.
I myself have done 683 on headshots with a ranged weapon.

http://prntscr.com/866iv9 town with 813 in the mortician. I have seen the duel reports, and 813 damage was against a FULL resist dueler :D

No one told you you're lying. Like I said before:

So for a level 3 harper's Axe, with damage range 39-260 and polishing stone, it would be a damage range of 69-310. Now 310 x 2.625 = 813.75 ~ 814. That's the max hit possible with the axe.

So techincally a Max hit of 940 is possible with a level 5 Boone's Axe, while in the case of a Level 3 Harper's Axe a max Hit of 814 is possible.

Actually, thanks for showing us that the 2.625x formula is the correct one. As you can see in your own screenprint, the highest hit is 813. I calculated it at 813.75 as the max hit and rounded of 814. You can't go beyond 814 with Level 3 harper's Axe. And that's what I've been trying to make you understand all day.

Now if you really want to prove that 3x the max damage of the weapon as the support says holds true, you can show me a duel where you hit, or some guy hits for 930 on a single headshot with a level 3 harper's axe. I will take back my word and say the formulas I've known for years and that have been up on wiki are totally wrong.
 
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DeletedUser32747

LOL Just because damage falls within your quoted range, does not prove you right...

ALL I wanted to do, is point out the MASSIVE gap between melee and ranged. This post was never about max damage, but about making things more even.

This has gotten heavily off topic.

IF I am wrong about the 3X damage, i apologize for arguing about it. But until slygoxx(or another senior marshal) comes and confirms that i was told wrong, I don't see a point in it bringing it up again on my part.


Anyway, back to the original topic! :)
 

DeletedUser35120

Sorry that me and Anny keep harping about it like seagulls, but are you absolutely sure? Havent seen anything like that mentioned in the update notes..

I would rather say "Sorry that me and gaga keep harping about it like seagulls and then get red-repped for for believing in the west-wiki". :laugh:

But yea Kidd, are you absolutely sure?
 

DeletedUser

I don't know how it's said the max possible damage is 3x the max damage of the weapon. It's supposed to be 2.625x the max damage of the weapon. (1.75 x 1.5)

So for a level 3 harper's Axe, with damage range 39-260 and polishing stone, it would be a damage range of 69-310. Now 310 x 2.625 = 813.75 ~ 814. That's the max hit possible with the axe.

Now for a level 5 Boone's Axe with damage range 53-308 and polishing stone, it would be a damage range of 83-358. Now 358 x 2625 = 939.75 ~ 940.

So techincally a Max hit of 940 is possible with a level 5 Boone's Axe, while in the case of a Level 3 Harper's Axe a max Hit of 814 is possible.

Building on what Anny said, her formula is the reason why nobody has hit higher than 656 with a Golden Tomahawk or Howdah. 250x2.625 = 656
 

Pankreas PorFavor

Well-Known Member
hm... with level 2 Harper's axe (36-240) I managed to hit 695.
240x2.625 = 630
the difference is 65, and polishing stone gives 30-50 damage. where does additional 15 come from?
this is the link to the report in Arizona: [report=63023451e7e2258eda]Duel: Pankreas PorFavor vs. sir oliver1[/report]
 

DeletedUser35120

hm... with level 2 Harper's axe (36-240) I managed to hit 695.
240x2.625 = 630
the difference is 65, and polishing stone gives 30-50 damage. where does additional 15 come from?
this is the link to the report in Arizona: [report=63023451e7e2258eda]Duel: Pankreas PorFavor vs. sir oliver1[/report]

When you use polishing stone, it adds the effect to the weapon.. so your Level Harper's axe actual damage range with polishing stone was 66-290.

290 x 2.625 =761.25 ~ 761 ← That's the max damage possible. And you were well within the limit.
 

Pankreas PorFavor

Well-Known Member
ah, indeed... in any case, I'll have to go back to dueling now that I upgraded the axe to level 3, and try to break my record, maybe even hit that 814 damage limit... ;) and in 54 months when I craft enough chilli to make a level 4 Harper's axe... :p :D
 

DeletedUser34408

I think there is a misconception that ranged duelers have a advantage over melee duelers in general. I think AP distribution is what determines your advantage, if a melee dueler places all his AP on strength they clearly have a huge HP advantage especially if they are soldier class and a ranged dueler who places all AP on Dexterity and spreads SP between Aim and Dodge will have a advantage over a melee aim/dodge build however the price of having a advantage on aim and dodge means a sacrifice in shooting which can be combated with a melee resistance build. If the effectiveness of Vigor/Appearance increases then Shooting/Appearance should be given the equivalent bonus in HP especially if secondary resistance gets stronger too. I personally think the balance of ranged vs melee builds is weighted perfectly as it is now for dueling.

Strength based Melee duelers also get non dueling advantages over ranged duelers, such as HP/Stamina to be more competitive in Fort Fights. A pure aim/dodge ranged dueler can barely do a job given that aim and dodge are skills not required for jobbing.

From my perspective, ranged duelers have an advantage over melee duelers with dodge/aim builds and melee duelers have an advantage over ranged duelers with resistance builds, sounds like a level playing field to me, no need to increase secondary resistance or bump up the effectiveness of vigor/appearance unless a equal HP bonus is given to ranged duelers.
 

DeletedUser35903

Too many rookie duelers here.
Ranged skilled to beat a melee will lose to a ranged dueler. primary skill to counter reflex, shooting, and it takes a lot!!
Ranged skilled to beat a ranged dueler will lose to a melee dueler. Fairly even distribution, fine tuning required.

The new dis-improvements have just ruined dueling anyways.
I'll either reskill to fort fighter or quit the game, I don't like being forced to play someone else's game.
The Alliance members just lost their protectors!!
 

DeletedUser35903

Yes I understand that, dueling is no longer a part of the game.
 

DeletedUser34408

The main problem has never been dueling, the servers once thrived with an abundance of duelers, the penalties incurred by non duelers is the problem - too severe.

The honor system is a step in a right direction, however, on Arizona I just dueled someone with 420 toughness, 350 reflex, 300 dodge and probably around 450 aim, he is lvl 141 and myself level 150 and I was awarded with a dishonorable duel.

My view is rather than cross reference skills between the 2 combatants , anyone with 50% or more of their SP on dueling skills (Aim, Dodge, Shooting, Vigor, Reflex, Toughness, Appearance, Tactics and Health) should be defined as honorable and to expand on the idea further, if anyone has under 50% of their SP on Dueling Skills at the time of a duel and they get KO'd then they should keep their original HP and Energy before the duel took place and only lose their money and find themselves back in the town hotel so it only becomes a small inconvenience for the non dueler to get KO'd also giving them 24hr protection from only the last person to KO them. KO protection/dueling time buffer should only apply to anyone KO'd who is honorable, i.e. they had 50% or more of their SP on dueling skills.
 

DeletedUser36979

The honor system really needs some work.

Basing it on some stats that constantly change is wrong and confusing... a change of clothes could easily make someone go from honorable target to dishonorable, or vice versa
It should be based at least partly on stats like levels, duel-levels, amount of initiated duels, win/loss ratio, etc.

And it should be easy to see before you initiate a duel if it is honorable or not.

Hopefully that will be the case by the time they come up with penalties for too many dishonorable duels, or perks for a lot of honorable duels, or whatever they plan on using yet another measuring stat for :laugh:
 
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