Crafting Why Keep Changing the recipes?

Spaceydk

Well-Known Member
Changed again! Level 600 for Field cook changed so no more 25 baked beans but instead 35 beans great now I can't use my 70 baked beans for anything! AND 2 more steel so 10 is needed instead of 8!
Field Cook is by far the most difficult recipe to get from 500 to 600 already with requirements of 150 ham, 650+ T-bone, 150 salt peter, 125+ granite!

If you want to make changes why not make things more easy instead of difficult?
Maybe make the 600 for Black smith a little easier because its soooooooooo hard.
Compare this:
140 beans, 40 steel, 40 granite, 43 coal, 4 hammer, 2 corn, cooking pot, habaneros chili, 4 minced meat
to:
4 sickle, 12 stirrup. 8 steel blade, 4 barb wire, 12 rust proof bolts, cog wheel, 2 gold dust, 2 pocket watch and roll of wire.

With the big prize being a useless weapon because I am skilled for range I am done crafting since I can get it onces so no change of selling it or getting the others. I am not even going to get the last 250 T-bone I need to make it the last way to 600 because maybe when I get there the recipe has changed again and I need another 400 T-bone, I liked crafting but you have finally managed to kill it completely with the UPB shop and ridiculous ever changing requirements to crafting so nothing left for me to do with no new quests.

And good job make cog wheel and habaneros random drops and cosack blanket and tooth possible to buy for nuggets.
What a joke.
 

DeletedUser

And actually, can I ask the logic in the quantities? OK, I understand you might need a lot of coal for the fire, and the world's weakest hammer (since when does a hammer get 'consumed' from one use?!?), but what is the insanity with needing 10 steel beams and 35 beans? What's the granite for? To build a single use BBQ pit? Has anyone ever heard of anything ridiculous like that before?

I don't have the time, hopefully someone else does, but could someone submit an idea into the Ideas section about reducing the quantities of items for recipes, and while you'are at it, reducing the 'consumability' of some durable items? (I've been harping on for a long time that it's just wrong of Inno to make the 'Jug' disappear when you craft a Jug of Water. A clay pot that only lasts once?!?. Hell, a bison stomach used as a canteen lasts longer).

This all goes back to that whole customer satisfaction thing. I mean I understand it's Inno's game and they can do whatever they want, set up any rules they want, do anything.

But where does it make sense (financially) to set up such an un-rewarding labor/craft system? I would LOVE to see the percentage of active players with crafting level above 250, compared to total players. My personal suspicion is that it's comically low, and only going to get lower.

Crafting was a great idea, but the way it's been implemented almost feels like someone in the dev/marketing dept thought 'Oh nuts, let's just give them all something to do until we can think of something better'...

Sorry for the rant, but this is one customer who's so massively under-satisfied with this potentially fun aspect of the game, turned into something so boring and ultimately feeling a little let-down.
 
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DeletedUser

Welcome to Inno's wonderful world of moving goalposts and pointless grinds!:)
 

Spaceydk

Well-Known Member
I am level 120 on Arizona and I loved crafting but the whole change receipes and with the unbalanced 500-600 recipes, UPB shop making crafting useless especially after lowing the price, crappy 600 level ONE item and nothing much else to do I think I am just going to let premium expire instead of quiting at first and then see what if I want to pick it up again or just sell off my shineys to town mates and quit.
 

DeletedUser

Yeah. The 600 recipe for blacksmith is, by far, the easiest to craft. All the other 3 are a lot harder.

Guess blacksmith is the new soldier. :unsure:
 

DeletedUser

As an addition to my last post, let's look at the numbers.

Amount of products needed to craft a "Golden music box" (Blacksmith 600)
333

Amount of products needed to craft a "Pony express saddlery" (Master saddler 600)
389

Amount of products needed to craft a "Fabled antidote" (Tonic peddler 600)
536

Amount of products needed to craft "The hottest chili in the West" (Field cook 600)
559

And you may say "oh but the more it takes the easier to get" - nope, the blacksmith products are the easiest to get. Cute, huh?
 

Spaceydk

Well-Known Member
druantia said:
As an addition to my last post, let's look at the numbers.

Amount of products needed to craft a "Golden music box" (Blacksmith 600)
333

Amount of products needed to craft a "Pony express saddlery" (Master saddler 600)
389

Amount of products needed to craft a "Fabled antidote" (Tonic peddler 600)
536

Amount of products needed to craft "The hottest chili in the West" (Field cook 600)
559

And you may say "oh but the more it takes the easier to get" - nope, the blacksmith products are the easiest to get. Cute, huh?
Click to expand...

Lets take it further and say you planned ahead so items you need but can't craft yourself so "foreign" crafts are needed (4x1 and 1x1):

Black Smith 12
Master Saddler 20
Tonic Peddler 24
Field Cook 40

Then compare the journey from 500 to 600 there its a big big difference on how easy it is. Some can use their own previously crafted items I have spend at least 400K+ to get from 500-589 on Arizona and right now one attempt at a crafting point is costing me around 12K and its a green recipe so 20-25K per crafting point at the moment.

I agree Black Smith is the new Soldier.
 
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DeletedUser

Shouldn't you look at the estimated time required to gather the stuff rather than the number of products?

If these estimates are accurate, you get reversed results...

Blacksmith: 286h 17min
Cook : 192h 36min
Tonic: 258h 30min
Saddler 252h 56min
 

DeletedUser25892

hinduf said:
Shouldn't you look at the estimated time required to gather the stuff rather than the number of products?

If these estimates are accurate, you get reversed results...

Blacksmith: 286h 17min
Cook : 192h 36min
Tonic: 258h 30min
Saddler 252h 56min
Click to expand...

This is totally off as Gam is right about cook....you need 8 STEAKS on the last one, I want you to go do 4(8) hours of steaks finding and let me know how many you get :).

MM2099
 

Spaceydk

Well-Known Member
Going from 500-605 is by far the easiest for the Tonic Peddler only hitch is the 40 Peace Flower needed since this is probably the rarest product used for crafting. I am level 375 Tonic Peddling and I plan ahead as I craft and when I hit 500 I will hit 600 in no time because the crafts are so easy since it requires products you have crafted already and pretty common products.

Black Smith its not to easy but you get products you need later or you get some good items that you can sell and a lot can be precrafted.

Master Saddler is probably the hardest since you need 2 foreign items that are hard to get Resin and Ornaments that need Gold Dust but then you get a lot of help on 600.

Field Cook the issue I have is the amount of the same products needed and not much help.
 

DeletedUser18357

Tonic peddler is not that easy... Have in mind that you need to work only on green recipe from 575 to 600 and guess what you need : herbal liqueur. Ok, if you're lucky 40 are enough here but only if you have a lot of batteries and you pushed hair lotion on green until 575... otherwise you need herbal from 550 to 600, working with green from 575 as i stated before. It seems 40 flowers are not enough in this case... Moreover, if we take in consideration that fabled antidote needs 3 herbals for 1 point it means you'll need another 75 peace flowers only between 600 and 625... from 625 to 650 you are on green again and God knows how much flowers you'll need :laugh: Yes, i'm an advanced tonic peddler and i guess i know what i said :)
 

Spaceydk

Well-Known Member
Lovendal said:
Tonic peddler is not that easy... Have in mind that you need to work only on green recipe from 575 to 600 and guess what you need : herbal liqueur. Ok, if you're lucky 40 are enough here but only if you have a lot of batteries and you pushed hair lotion on green until 575... otherwise you need herbal from 550 to 600, working with green from 575 as i stated before. It seems 40 flowers are not enough in this case... Moreover, if we take in consideration that fabled antidote needs 3 herbals for 1 point it means you'll need another 75 peace flowers only between 600 and 625... from 625 to 650 you are on green again and God knows how much flowers you'll need :laugh: Yes, i'm an advanced tonic peddler and i guess i know what i said :)
Click to expand...

I just checked I am level 362.
Got 77 batteries now and keep making more probably until 400 or when I have 120 or so. Then I switch to Lye and make them until I have 50-60 of those so I can use them and maybe I can get to 535 with those and from 535 to 575 with batteries.
I do not start with the Herbal Liquer until 575, since batteries and Lye are pretty easy to craft.
I do not start to do the Herb Liquer until the recipe turns grey at 500 since it increases the chance of excellent result.

I do batteries until 400
Craft Lye to maybe 435
Compass to 450
Then a combination of Lye, Compass and Rose Water depending on whats available on the market.
500-535 Snake Oil
535-575 Hair Lotion
575-600 Fine Liquor

For me crafting ends at 605 if the quest is not repeatable and there are no new recipes then why continue?

On my Field Cook world I did the 525 mostly to 550 and it were cheaper T-Bone wise because I got a crafting point more than 60% of the time I kept track of it in the beginning:
I got 16 points from 25 crafts and 5 excellent results from do Marinate a Steak so it cost me total of 92 T-Bone to get 16 points if I had done Spareribs 16 points would have cost me 128 T-Bones. T-Bones being the hardest to buy it made it easier for me depsite having to get 6 Salt Peter, 8 Rum and a cooking pot. It also saved me a little Charcoal.
Some times its better to do the green and get 50%+ chance of a crafting point than doing the yellow recipe it depends on the availability of the items. I also did a lot of Prepare Sauce instead of Fish in a Newspaper because it were easier to get 5 pumpkins than 3 salmon from 350-450 I did almost only Prepare Sauce because it were so much easier and I ended up with 120+ sauce :D
 
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DeletedUser18357

Yes, you follow my pattern, batteries and lye :) I described that case in the first part of my post and 40-50 flowers are probably enough, how i said. But overall, if you want to reach 650 and wait more updates to crafting (because surely it will continue somehow, or is more stupid than already it is if don't :D) you'll need at least 100-120 flowers, and more nasty products as jugs, cobra teeth, another 100 lotus (after you consumed probably 100)... and so on. In my opinion, we can't use the word "easy" here or on the other 3 professions, were not meant to be easy, rather to keep you busy and forget the uselessness of what you doing :D
 

DeletedUser

hinduf said:
Shouldn't you look at the estimated time required to gather the stuff rather than the number of products?

If these estimates are accurate, you get reversed results...

Blacksmith: 286h 17min
Cook : 192h 36min
Tonic: 258h 30min
Saddler 252h 56min
Click to expand...

As already said in the beta forum.

The estimated crafting time shown in the database is not accurate at all. According to it, the blacksmith recipe takes the longer to craft which isn't true. The products for blacksmith are easier to get, besides there are some like hammers, saws, sledge hammers, coals, that are easily obtainable in jobs other than their original ones, such as Build palisades and Dig for rare gemstones.

There isn't one single hard-to-get product in the later blacksmith recipes, besides a gold dust which is needed in its 'raw state'.
 
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DeletedUser

The estimated time on tw-db is just the average if you did it an infinite amount of times. Results may vary.
 

DeletedUser

An estimation must be minimally accurate. Many products drop from more than one job, and that alone changes the time completely. In my opinion the "estimated time" shouldn't be there.
 

DeletedUser

druantia said:
An estimation must be minimally accurate. Many products drop from more than one job, and that alone changes the time completely. In my opinion the "estimated time" shouldn't be there.
Click to expand...

"Many" is an exaggeration, at least as far as jobs that are useful for grinding the products go. Sure, you can get a lot of sledge hammers from traveling merchant, but it's only useful for farming them or anything else if you're doing the job anyway. Build palisades is a little bit different. If you're looking for just one of the products, it's not efficient, but if you're patient and don't mind taking longer to get to your next 50 skill, it's good for preparing ahead, at least for blacksmiths.

Anyway, if you want TW-DB to change or remove time from crafting, suggest it in their thread in External Sites. My biggest complaint is that product requirements for crafted items from other professions isn't included in the time.
 
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