Adventures discussion and feedback

[DeletedUser36011]

I said 360, based on level 150 and average base damage. Same for 340 on the outlaw. you cna do the math yourself and see the difference on the average hits. But with the outlaw gun at the same level, right at the top ie level 145 or more, they can hit 700 without worry .

Its all about everyone else being ill equipped to handle the event winners guns and not using the correct tactics with double team etc atm moreso than the event guns. Give it time, and the gear thing will solve itself. The lack of tactics, or human intelligence, that is another story altogether

 

[DeletedUser]

I said 360, based on level 150 and average base damage. Same for 340 on the outlaw. you cna do the math yourself and see the difference on the average hits. But with the outlaw gun at the same level, right at the top ie level 145 or more, they can hit 700 without worry .

Have you accounted for the attributes which are twice than in the outlaw? The additional dexterity gives damage bonus, the additional charisma gives critical hit bonus. Add that to the math and average is much higher. And that is without sacrificing the health as in the case of Hamage's or Haim's.

 

[DeletedUser36011]

Have you accounted for the attributes which are twice than in the outlaw? The additional dexterity gives damage bonus, the additional charisma gives critical hit bonus. Add that to the math and average is much higher. And that is without sacrificing the health as in the case of Hamage's or Haim's.

The attributes are actually more with the outlaw, as you are getting the attributes as part of the set that you are not getting from wearing your normal guns. Your clothing set AP is irrelevant in all normal instances, unless the set bonus is part of your gunset too

For example outlaw clothing + special weapons = no AP bonus to you because the bonus is only on your clothing. The guns arent part of the outlaw set so no bonus.
Complete outlaw set, the bonus from your clothing is also counted because the gun add to this clothing bonus too. So more AP.

To put this into context, the Steam rifle adds far less AP than that, for a little more damage. Average damage multiplier being approx 1.5 time the base damage of the weapon(crits are different) then there is not as big of a gap when you go damage vs skills. You then have to weigh up are all the extra AP worth the tiny bit of extra damage

 

[asdf124]

The attributes are actually more with the outlaw, as you are getting the attributes as part of the set that you are not getting from wearing your normal guns. Your clothing set AP is irrelevant in all normal instances, unless the set bonus is part of your gunset too

For example outlaw clothing + special weapons = no AP bonus to you because the bonus is only on your clothing. The guns arent part of the outlaw set so no bonus.
Complete outlaw set, the bonus from your clothing is also counted because the gun add to this clothing bonus too. So more AP.

To put this into context, the Steam rifle adds far less AP than that, for a little more damage. Average damage multiplier being approx 1.5 time the base damage of the weapon(crits are different) then there is not as big of a gap when you go damage vs skills. You then have to weigh up are all the extra AP worth the tiny bit of extra damage

But that would mean you would be exploiting a bug......... Which is what they are calling it in the information.....

You should think about what dexterity does, meaning that you might actually make more than the steam rifle really....

So, I should use my ludwig set instead. Thanks for the tip .

 

[DeletedUser20688]

I said 360, based on level 150 and average base damage. Same for 340 on the outlaw. you cna do the math yourself and see the difference on the average hits. But with the outlaw gun at the same level, right at the top ie level 145 or more, they can hit 700 without worry .

Its all about everyone else being ill equipped to handle the event winners guns and not using the correct tactics with double team etc atm moreso than the event guns. Give it time, and the gear thing will solve itself. The lack of tactics, or human intelligence, that is another story altogether

The only flaw in this logic is in the "tactics" you speak of in many of your posts. There are none that work consistently. In a 5 vs. 5 game what you are suggesting is you double or triple team a player like yourself. To triple team that means someone is not on a white square. That means your team eventually wins as there's not enough folks on the mill in the end game. If you are double teamed, that's two guns on one target for probably 10 rounds (You have 6000+ HP and average damage over all players is maybe 175). That means one player on your team has no active opponent. Ergo, your team has more HP over time. You win.

I played against you last night and your team also had a 5000+ HP player with a Hank revolver. It was hopeless.

Yes the tombola weapons are here to stay. I get it. You paid probably 500 dollars to get it so that wins and you deserve it. However, please don't suggest that it takes a high IQ to defeat a fat credit card. That's incredibly insulting. Just describe it for what it is: rich players beat poor players.

 

[DeletedUser]

As long I don't see any balance between high level players and low level, why need to be between normal weapon and tombola weapon??? Try to play small character in this position:
a high level player and two low level vs two high level players and a low level, you'll see that you have no chance to win.

 

[Ripwise]

Whichever argument said the fact is there is no balance at all.

One more thing, can anyone explain what is this strategy or tactics everyone are talking about? All i see, go to mill and i am going to bank/saloon.

Seems people are putting arguments out there making it look bigger/broader than it actually is.

I am still waiting for the fun part!

 

[DeletedUser36559]

Once I saw a level 4 on my team without a weapon equipped, who's never played before aswell against a level 85 on the other side with outlaw rifle so we had a delay in trying to get him to know the basics before he got to grips with going to bank then snipe from bank etc..

I think the strategy and tactics everyone is talking about in terms about beating event guns is trying to figure out a way to win with your team player's weapons and HP. Problem with double/ triple teaming an event gun player is as Orgo already said they automatically lose the player advantage at the mill due to not being on the white tiles. Say two level 100 players with 3k HP each with golden guns tag team an event gun player they hit on average 300 a hit and the event gun player (6k HP) usually hits 600. According to this either of them can win depending on who misses/ friendly fire and other variables which have to be taken into account but the event gun player can himself KO one of them while leaving the other with little to no HP, that's 2 already down at the mill meaning the event gun player's team will always tend to have the player advantage. Only thing which can be done is tag teaming other players and trying to avoid the event gun player as many times as possible since it will take too long to kill him in the first place and if he is KO'ed he's back in 3.

 

[DeletedUser36011]

The tactics are simple, its not up to me to explain them to you. It's up to you to figure them out. The tactics vary from situation to situation and you can use certain ones at certain times, it is about a person or teams ability to read the adventure as it goes tactically. If you try to fight solely on the mill against the person with an event gun as your primary focus of course the person with the biggest gun is usually going to win unless friendly fire occurs.

Many players have figured out how to combat them effectively enough already, as Micky has said. So maybe I am being insulting, but it is not up to me to tell you how to beat the event winners it is up to you to read the way the adventure is going and move accordingly.

Rip, many people are very much focused on the mill and fight at the mill and only keep two buildings without realising there is another building out there they could cancel out or capture themself. Sadly most keep fighting for the mill when it is lost. Dont ask me why this is the case though. It's really a good idea to keep going 1v3 into the mill every turn and getting shot off as you move towards it though (sarcasm)

 

[asdf124]

That is what I call a mill zombie pty

I seriously hate it when peeps see it as lost and keep going for it while the bank is pretty weak at that moment. The same goes when you capture the mill and no opponent is on it, you should always go for bank unless you are being pressurized which is usually not the case. They usually try to have mill + saloon or mill +bank.

leaving the last building as not being thoughtful.

I do know that being greedy might be a bad thing but going offensive sometimes is the best defense specially if you were waiting for the opposing team to resurrect.

So, if you wanted to win against an event player, their is multiple strategies, one of em is to simply avoid him.

2. Try to divide his team and conquer.

3. Tag teaming him/ making him do the dirty work of koing the weak players.

 

[Deleted User - 3853873]

lol Pty Ltd i have played with you many times and against and I have do dis agree some what.Your toon is a beast and you know how to play the game,so when I am on your team the game is under control and easy to get 3 buildings.But in a normal game when things are equal all you have to do is keep 2 buidlings and you win,but in most games I am in people do not wait until they are under control and go after a 3rd building and lose the mill because they want that 3rd building which I find stupid of them. All the tatics and different play styles dont mean crap or the weapon a person has when people just cant figure out how to play and win lol.Some people just dont get how the scoring system works or maybe they should work as a team lol.
So I do really agree with what your saying and micky too,I just have a little different opinion when the teams are equal.I do agree if you lost a building its dumb keep trying to get it,but the game all depends on when the other team will res and how many rounds,how many you have up at the time .many factors go into all the different situations.I dont think a lot of people relize how many rounds it takes to get to the mill or saloon to try and take and how many rounds it takes to cap it.Add those together and if sending 2 and 3 people to get a third building is smart or hurting your other building by leaving it less defended. THis is just my 2 cents lol,I got your sarcasm and agree lol.
There is so many different factors that goes into playing the game with different situtations that arise,no one could say exactly how to play it,just play smart and move as a team and work together and have a good chance of winning.

 

[DeletedUser36011]

Tactics are tactics, whether the teams are even or unequal. If a team works together and has better tactics when they are outgunned, out-HPed or both, it gives them a better shot at winning. If a superior team has better tactics then they are just going to win bigger. If they're even, again, lust like for an 'inferior' team it just gives them a abetter chance at winning.

People get caught up on who is stronger and who is weaker by mere numbers, this is somewhat the case. The team which works together best though is the superior team. Not the one with the best numbers.

As for fighting with or against WJ. Why do you do well when you are with me, you follow the chats, you see how people explain what they are doing and why, or follow the directives of other players. That is the teamwork that we are talking about

 

[DeletedUser20688]

Oh man.. ok this is really starting to get..well arrogant. However, for whatever reason I'll try to reassert my argument and hope it's not once against dismissed by "Well, you're just not very tactical (i.e. You're stupid, but yeah I do have 6000+ hp and a 700+ crit so yeah)."

Ok so what you are neglecting is that 99.99% of the time the Saloon is claimed by Red and the bank is already claimed by Blue. So, basically what you are saying is that an underpowered team can actually catch up on points after typically failing to take the Mill by simply taking the already possessed opposing structure? That rarely works. The other team by 10+ rounds has the point advantage. A toon like yours PtyLtd can wipe two players that might try for the opposing building before the requisite 3 rounds pass to make a difference. Could you miss once or twice? Sure. But even then since the spawn point of dead players makes it super-easy to halt the opposite team from possessing the building...I just don't see your point about these "secret" tactics.

You're making these broad statements that aren't changing the point I'm making at all. I know you play a lot so I just don't understand except...you have no experience playing as a low-level (under 100) toon. Actually that might explain everything.

 

[asdf124]

once you get bank, you will draw the opposing team's attention, you would go for mill afterwards, sometimes, you don't need to get the other buildings.

Sometimes you just need to not let the opposing side to simply not get it back, which can be pretty challenging but not impossible.

It is also pretty hard and rare to make comebacks since your morale would be shattered.

Morale means that your team would listen to anyone at that point if one team player stands up that is.

 

[DeletedUser20688]

once you get bank, you will draw the opposing team's attention, you would go for mill afterwards, sometimes, you don't need to get the other buildings.

Sometimes you just need to not let the opposing side to simply not get it back, which can be pretty challenging but not impossible.

It is also pretty hard and rare to make comebacks since your morale would be shattered.

Morale means that your team would listen to anyone at that point if one team player stands up that is.

I'd be really suspect of any Blue player that didn't see Red going for the Bank in the first place ages before it was taken.

 

[Deleted User - 3853873]

They say that rifle and level come into play on what your health point level is.But i noticed its more your rifle your playing with.Im not saying level 5 and a level 150 has chance of being close,thats just silly but I have seen people 20 levels higher than me have lower hp cause they have a crappy weapon,that seams weird to me.
I have to agree with pty ltd that teamwork is the key to winning.and for orgo a example is if your team lost the mill and oppisite team goes to mill thinking your going to keep fighting for it.you use a tatic of sending a couple to there base and it pulls them away from the mill.it throws them off balance and lot time they start scrambling,but if your team communicates and plays well together you end up geting the mill and win,have done that many times to come from behind.of course it wont work if your to far behind and your team is squishy and dies easy.Lot this game is luck also

 

[DeletedUser36011]

Oh man.. ok this is really starting to get..well arrogant. However, for whatever reason I'll try to reassert my argument and hope it's not once against dismissed by "Well, you're just not very tactical (i.e. You're stupid, but yeah I do have 6000+ hp and a 700+ crit so yeah)."

Ok so what you are neglecting is that 99.99% of the time the Saloon is claimed by Red and the bank is already claimed by Blue. So, basically what you are saying is that an underpowered team can actually catch up on points after typically failing to take the Mill by simply taking the already possessed opposing structure? That rarely works. The other team by 10+ rounds has the point advantage. A toon like yours PtyLtd can wipe two players that might try for the opposing building before the requisite 3 rounds pass to make a difference. Could you miss once or twice? Sure. But even then since the spawn point of dead players makes it super-easy to halt the opposite team from possessing the building...I just don't see your point about these "secret" tactics.

You're making these broad statements that aren't changing the point I'm making at all. I know you play a lot so I just don't understand except...you have no experience playing as a low-level (under 100) toon. Actually that might explain everything.

It's not about a strong player going to the bank, its about the situation at the time, you send one player and you wont necessarily capture it fast, or at all. Sometimes two or three is needed. Usually the lowest HP is on the bank so they are easy to kill for 2 players of a normal level. If that player has a fast trigger finger and can run well, 1v1 it isnt going to matter a heck of alot, but you can still push that runner into the corner and keep them away from the mill and shooting at it anyway(resulting in a later numbers advantage on the mill since you go back from the bank to mill). Usually if you lose the first mill skirmish the other team has a HP disadvantage anyway because your respawners have fresh HP which they can then use to take the mill. It's about recognising when the mill is lost and when it isnt. Same thing for actually learning when it is a good time to die when you are in the lead. It's not implying people are stupid though, just not able to recognise yet the actions needed to be taken in certain situations.

Because of the way it 'balances' with levels you will usually have a high level player that can do 600+ hits without worry(because we are comparing the crit vallue maximums it seems). Against a player under 2500 HP, it isnt going ot take long to kill them anyway. Lets use the play 'Duck on Quack' for an example. He is level 148, he uses Outlaw rifle(but misses a good portion of the set to increase damage further. He consistently hits for that 600+ range. There is very little difference between the 600 and 700 ranges, and he has over 4k HP. His damage and his HP would increase much more by using more outlaw gear as it is obtained.

 

[DeletedUser26820]

As this post is like the 2133rd or 2134th or something like that post in this thread, I'm not reading all or replying to any, either generally or specifically.

Instead, as per Da Twista's first post in this thread, summarized as reporting bugs, discussing adventures & providing feedback, I'm doing as such.
So this is MY post in that regards.
Opinion or feedback on requested feedback is really not necessary.

I LOVE ADVENTURES.

They're something I can do after I've set my toon to 5 hours of construction or 8 hours of work. They're not mandatory but activity based. Win or lose, they bring veteran points that accumulate to a bond shop purchase that further enhances my toon, added by the opportunity for loot chest luck drops.

ADVENTURES are an opportunity for about 15 minutes of cross-world camaraderie.
Because this dynamic has become available, I've met and interacted with toons from other worlds that are spirited, vibrant, and share a general appreciation of the game.
For that, I enjoy ADVENTURES.

Are there bugs? I've seen some.

Are there some that take advantage of them? Maybe.

Have I run into a specific ADVENTURE where one on my team might be slacking to give some buddies on the other team an advantage to win? Maybe a few times.

Do tombola event weapon sets have an "unfair" advantage? To the unprepared toon or unprepared opposing team, yes. But as a holder of Manitu's, I've won and lost against other tombola weapon sets. I've won and lost against the new ADVENTURE weapon items that start with "H" but as I haven't won one yet, I can't reference them specifically. I just know they help and bring pain and offset tombola event weapon sets.

Have I been part of a greater weapons + greater hp team lose to an opponent that was better skilled with tactics and coordination and team work? Yes.

So in response to the first post in this thread, from Da Twista, I've provided some feedback and discussed adventures.

I appreciate Inno for introducing this dynamic to game as it's voluntary and something that can be done with "dead" toon time.
Doubt you guys will bring back Poker (remember that?), but my toon on construction or a job while in an ADVENTURE while playing Poker is finally multi-tasking and making maximum use of my time online

Thanks, Inno. Keep up the great work.

 

[DeletedUser]

Morale means that your team would listen to anyone at that point if one team player stands up that is.

If you mean that one player playing bad can make the whole team play bad, you're right. If you say that one person standing up and volunteering to lead when things are going bad can make others listen to him, then I disagree, that doesn't happen much. For example, I was in a 4v4 where one of the players was afk/inactive from the first second. Another player said "we lost cuz we r short" and started playing a solo game as if getting a high damage score would allow him to earn more VPs. I told him that I have played a lot of adventures and we can still win though we have a disadvantage. He said "we already lost cuz we r short" and continued with his solo game. We ended up getting 50 VPs for that game.

As this post is like the 2133rd or 2134th or something like that post in this thread, I'm not reading all or replying to any, either generally or specifically.

We're only in two hundreds, not two thousands.
Check the top-right corner of your post to see how many posts the topic has had.

Do tombola event weapon sets have an "unfair" advantage? To the unprepared toon or unprepared opposing team, yes. But as a holder of Manitu's, I've won and lost against other tombola weapon sets. I've won and lost against the new ADVENTURE weapon items that start with "H" but as I haven't won one yet, I can't reference them specifically. I just know they help and bring pain and offset tombola event weapon sets.

Hank's is for tanks. It gives +STR and adds to your HP (a lot)
Hamage's is for damages. It gives +DEX and adds damage to your base damage.
Haim is for aim. It gives +Charisma which gives you higher chance of critical hit.
Hodge is for dodge. It gives +Mobility which increases your dodge chance.

Now to my post, here's a suggestion for the positive instead of all the complaining I've been doing.
We know that the teams are made based on player levels and sometimes the teams are very off-balance because it is their guns that matter. We can't make teams based on guns in the current system because guns can be changed after teams are made. So why not lock the inventory when a player clicks "Ready" like when you can't change gear when you have a duel queued. This way players can't change guns after teams have been made and the balancing can be done considering both player levels and their guns.

 

[Ripwise]

What i see here for a fact is wishfull thinking that adventures are tactical or strategical. The design itself is made so it doesnt allow for any complex strategy or tactics.

It is designed first come or higher hp and thats it. Whatever argument you put out there is simply wishfull thinking and overinflation of simple game.