accept/decline duels

how annoying is randomly being duelled to you?


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DeletedUser

Or if you keep being dueled then the simple answer is to simply stop doing high cash jobs and work solely on exp jobs, people will soon stop hitting you then.
 

DeletedUser

Ashki, BigDawg,
I think you both are on the same page and that an idea or tow could get worked out.
There are MANY valid points to what both of you are saying and should be considered by the devs.
I really think they will not change anything but should be considered.

Furrie, I have, along with all the others that post on here, as much to say what i want as you do. I'll continue to post and if you don't like what I post, ignore it.
Again, to your questions, maybe go read what you wrote in response to my posts. I'm real sure you can figure out profanity, derogatory and basically attempting to capitalize on your side instead of being objective.
So, complain that I complain, whatever floats your boat.
I'm not buying the lack of caffeine. Geesh
And I am not a hypocrite. I am more inclined to listen (read) the voices of reason. Which is why I am concluding my conversations with you. moot.
Keep it up Ashki and Dawg...!!!
 

DeletedUser

No personal insults please, let's not start a flame war. Let's work together to see what we can come up with rather than arguing.
 

DeletedUser

I am builder too but I don't see reason for accept/decline duel.
Everyone will most likely use only decline button anyway. And then next thing that will be asked is "automatically decline" button.

And as a bulder I am already better than dueler.
I get more exp than other classes
High class jobs that require construction gives a lot gold and exp.
Most of my money is safe in the bank. Even if someone attacks me he can't steal all.
And all duelers grow fast in dueling level that prevents them attacking me or at least makes them get almost no exp. So duelers that attack me are

Honestly, why do you think that getting low exp for beating you is bad balance?
I could agree there must be something to motivate dueler fight other duelers.
Maybe dueler should get 50% more exp for fighting other dueler
Idea about increasing time before next duel if attacking weak player sounded good too.
 

DeletedUser

All I see are fighters complaining because non-fighters don't want to fight
Truth of the matter is; We got people whining like small children about beeing attacked in a game that advertises dueling on it's front page!
If people want to play a game where they do not get dueled, I could recommend The Sims.

But if the non-fighters are forced to spend all their points and money on defense, then just when do they stop being profitable targets for the fighters? They'll always remain on the hit list simply because they're forced to be a fighter or have to live townless and thus spend more on equipment than anyone else in te game (outside of people in isolated towns).
Noone are forcing them. They chose to be weak at defending themselves on there own.
Thus it'll work out in the end. However IF they choose to deviate from this, and get combat skills, then they might ward off a few attacks now and then, but the trade-off will be that they remain targets. You can't have it both ways.

Banking isn't about being smart, its about being available.
Valid point, and it has been suggested that one should be able to queue banking as an action. Still though, some people carry a stupifying amount of cash with them.

True, but you're forgeting the equipment he needs to be an effective builder
No, I don't. Duelers also need equipment to be effective duelers, your point is moot, as construction clothes in no way are way more expensive than all other clothes.

Or the player isn't online. If I'm gone for 12 hours and want to hide in a hotel, I'll have to give up working and live in the hotel. That or buy premium so I can work AND spend two job slots in the hotel while I'm off dealing with RL work and family.
How is this refuting my points about adventurers beeing stupid if they are not selling their stuff whilst sleeping in the hotel? If you seriously do not want to be open for attacks at all, and don't have premium, then you queue 2 periods of sleep.
It's a choice, and the concequence is that you don't get to work.

And let's not even get into the notion that I'd wear defensive gear all day long just in case... So how could I expect anyone else to?
Plenty of active duelers do, just to be on top of their game.

fighters have the advantage of higher duelling skills. A person chooses to be a worker becuase he wants to work, not because he wants to fight agaisnt a class designed for fighting. Thus he's at a disavantage.
Everyone may CHOOSE to have high duel skills.
There is only ONE class that has advantages that DIRECTLY affect the outcome of any given duel, and only then if specced for it.

And as for stopping work, that's what he's expected to do as it is. However, I was speaking of an automatic clothes change if he's not on. It wouldn't stop him working on whateer job he's doing at the time, although it may stop queued jobs, I'll grant that.
If he needs the bonuses on hs current clothes to perform the task he is doing at that very time, then indeed it will stop him from performing that task, otherwise what you suggest would be highly exploitable.

But isn't this the heart of the problem? I'm sure if all the fighters were told "you've had every chance to pump all your duelling points into trading" and that it's their fault they're not good traders, they'd throw a royal fit.
Do you hear duelers complain about not beeing able to mine silver at lvl 17?
WHy don't you hear taht? May it be because they have realized that it's a tradeoff?

The whole point of a non-fighter is to excel at things that aren't fighting. The point of a fighter is to excel at fighting. But this entire thread has been saying that a non-fighter must excel in fighting or it's their own fault they're easy targets. Which again brings up the thought that it's pointless tohave non-combat classes with this mentality dictating the continuation ofan imbalance in gameplay.

No, this is about choices. If you choose to ignore every defensive skill, then that is your own damn fault. Just as a dueler or soldier is not entitled to whine about not beeing able to build as a pure builder, trap as a pure trapper, or trade as a pure trader. Consequence and choice. Noone are forcing you to choose eitehr way.

A non-fighter should not be expected to excel at fighting and be told it's their fault if they don'
We don't expect a non-fighter to excel at fighting, we expect him to know fighting is not his forte, and stop crying about not excelling within said field. I don't think that is too much to ask for.

EDIT:
Thank you Bryen.
 

DeletedUser5209

I am builder too but I don't see reason for accept/decline duel.
Everyone will most likely use only decline button anyway. And then next thing that will be asked is "automatically decline" button.

And as a bulder I am already better than dueler.
I get more exp than other classes
High class jobs that require construction gives a lot gold and exp.
Most of my money is safe in the bank. Even if someone attacks me he can't steal all.
And all duelers grow fast in dueling level that prevents them attacking me or at least makes them get almost no exp. So duelers that attack me are

Honestly, why do you think that getting low exp for beating you is bad balance?
I could agree there must be something to motivate dueler fight other duelers.
Maybe dueler should get 50% more exp for fighting other dueler
Idea about increasing time before next duel if attacking weak player sounded good too.
I haven't read anything else in this thread but I was told to look at this post, and the bolded part sounds like some nice ideas.

I have nothing more to say.
 

DeletedUser

A lot of ideas have been thrown out there, some good, some not. There are two fighter classes and two merchant classes. Duellers and Workers are the two most often mentioned, but let's remember the other two need to be considered as well. So far, these seem like the best options. I'll list with pros and cons:

1. EXP penalty/bonus - Fighters recieve EXP based on level difference. Beating someone with a higher Duelling level earns you a bonus, a lower level earns a penalty. Fighting a player whose char and duel levels are equal (i.e. a non-fighter) earns half bonus/double penalty. If a non-fighter has a higher duel level than char, the difference reduces this penalty (say, 10% per level difference), as he's essentially cross-classed.

Thus, a Dueller fighting a Solder at same level earns 100% EXP. if D's DL=24 and S's DL=26, then D earns 120% EXP. If S's DL is only 22, then the dueller only gets 80% EXP. Note that this applies to soldiers as well (we're ignoring class bonuses in this example for simplicity)

Meanwhile, our dueller fights an adventurer, L=24, DL=24. He'd earn 50% EXP. If A has a DL of 26, then he'd earn 70% EXP. If the adventurer's L and DL was 26, he'd earn 70% while a DL of 28 would make him 90%.

Pros: More balance is given, and fighters are encouraged to fight other fighter classes. Non-fighters who choose to duel will stand out as more viable targets than true-class chars.

Cons: A lot of variable programming is involved, and we're also looking at having to find the perfect base penalty for fighting non-fighters.


2. Bodyguard - Create a single-use item that prevents one duel.

The player equips this item in their item slot (or a new use-item slot is created). If targetted for a duel, the item "repels" the dueller, preventing the duel and wasting the dueller's time (if he wasn't looking at the equipment list for his target and tried to attack). However, the item is then used up and that char can now be attacked normally until another item is equipped. The item must obviously be fairly cheap (perhaps $15-20?) and available in any town.

Pros: This provides limited protection to a player, deturring most duellers.

Cons: A determined dueller won't care about a few minutes wasted and will simply trigger the item, then duel again (although towns can mark such players as prime retal targets to help create balance against such zealousness). Also, if a player is offline, he can't re-equip the item and auto-equipping would create an imbalance.


3. Auto-Equip - The target (IF OFFLINE) will automatically equip his best defense gear during a duel.

To make this a bit easier, the game could simply give the bonuses for the clothing without actually altering equipped items under the assumption that any online player would have changed clothes.

Pros: While not stopping duels against non-fighters, this provides some degree of support against attacks, yet does nothing that the player would not have done were he online to do so.

Cons: The game would have to run through all of the variables in the person's inventory to find the best defense bonuses, which leaves room for bugs in the programming. Also, this does not stop duels, only improves defense, so it will only partially restore balance to the game.
 

DeletedUser

1. EXP...ummm no.

You are setting up for lower leveled players to hit higher leveled players without the higher level being able to retaliate without penalty. They already receive a penalty because they already DON'T get as much xp as hitting a higher leveled or equal player.

Also how many times does this have to be said. Anybody can pick any class they want and spec however they want. Just because you pick worker doesn't mean you have to spec in construction. You could spec as a fighter. I've dueled workers and some of them hit hard. Sometimes they win. Why? Because they don't ignore they dueling skills.

2. Bodyguard...ummm no.

This is just another accept/decline option that is unfair to 2 classes of players. When a pure worker is denied the opportunity to construct a building then I'll accept fighter classes being denied to work in their chosen profession.

3. Auto-Equip...ummmm no

An additional con you did not state is that if that player is offline and working a job and is wearing gear they need to work that job, what happens when they have to switch clothes that put them below the labor points they need? That is the most likely scenario. When you log off I assume you will either be sleeping in a hotel (thereby being unduelable) or you will be working at a job. This will force workers to have to STOP working to duel. Then that worker will just be standing around after the duel waiting for you to get back online to put him back to work. If anything this will hinder a workers game play.
 
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DeletedUser

This is exactly the problem with the system as it is now, the only solution to not getting your butt handed to you in a duel is to pump all of your available skill points into the dueling skills, therefore making you into a dueler even though you want to be a worker or adventurer.

The developers need to make dueling more fair, whether the duel is between 2 dueler class players or any other classes. By allowing the duel initiator to select the opponent from to wide of a range of level deviations and not allowing any chance for the defender to change out items prior to the duel, either with a duel notice system or automatic clothes changes, the duel is to unbalanced in favor of the initiator of the duel.

That’s not to say if changes are made to duels then maybe duelers might need to have their means of making money evaluated. By all means, dueler class player should be able to get cash just like everyone else, but they shouldn’t be able to get it by fleecing workers that are 20+ levels below them in a duel that 99 times out of 100 is a slaughter.

Nobody is forcing you to be a pure worker, nor is anyone forcing you to be a pure dueler or even a hybrid.

I started out as a builder, then got envious at the amount of money my dueler friends are making and tried my hands at dueling a few times. I am now mostly worker.

You don't have to waste all your skills on aim or dodge. Some duelers simply look for "crime of opportunity." Smarter duelers will not waste their energy on endless dueling you for no profit. Don't make yourself an attractive target.

For example, I pumped up my aim and dodge a bit. I then pumped up my vigor so I can do clearing forest. As long as I can get decent melee weapon (hopefully sharp), you can get a lot of mileage out of pumping up either vigor or shooting, as long as you pump up your aim a bit, and a bit of dodge.

Do duelers duel me? Sure, do I lose? Sure. However, even with rusty machette and I did not aim for head, I can still do about 100 points of damage, giving those duelers a pause before they pick on me again (unless they want to knock me out, which is great, that means I get 48 hours of free time to focus on cash jobs without worries).

Duelers love high cash, low damage targets. They have a limited HP so it's better to pump up aim, pump up your shooting or vigor by a lot, and some dodge so you can last long enough to finish your job. The point is to hurt your attacker so they are forced to check into a hotel to recover and duel less.
 

DeletedUser

Ashki, BigDawg,
I think you both are on the same page and that an idea or tow could get worked out.
There are MANY valid points to what both of you are saying and should be considered by the devs.
I really think they will not change anything but should be considered.

Furrie, I have, along with all the others that post on here, as much to say what i want as you do. I'll continue to post and if you don't like what I post, ignore it.
Again, to your questions, maybe go read what you wrote in response to my posts. I'm real sure you can figure out profanity, derogatory and basically attempting to capitalize on your side instead of being objective.
So, complain that I complain, whatever floats your boat.
I'm not buying the lack of caffeine. Geesh
And I am not a hypocrite. I am more inclined to listen (read) the voices of reason. Which is why I am concluding my conversations with you. moot.
Keep it up Ashki and Dawg...!!!

Im quite happy to keep replying to you, again YOU keep telling me that YOU are done with the arguement yet YOU keep coming back to reply to me. If you are going to accuse me of insulting you then I suggest that you provide evidence or apologise. This has been emphasised in a few of my previous posts.

- No grammar crusade.
Quoted from the rules. Woop de doo I missed an E off the word. You cannot spell my name.

I am not being objective I admit it, however neither are you. I am instead attempting to make you realise that you are not being objective. See I admit it, can you?

As to the caffeine, seriously are you trying to insult me? Trust me I've heard worse.

The thing is you don't want to admit that you did not consider the balancing issue of nerfing duelers income and exp gains, where as I have tried to argue that they are not that overpowered and I speak from the experience of playing an adventurer, a worker and a dueler.

Seriously you need to look at your replies, there is no effort to counter my arguements. Please show me where I have done all these things, even better report them all, see if the mods/admins agree with you on this.
 
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DeletedUser

icon8.gif
accept/decline duels
really, the most annoying thing of this game is the fact that you can't accept or decline duels. heres me merrily doing what I want, when some random nerd duels me. i don't even have a mortician in my town! how the hell did he duel me!?!:mad: I suggest an accept/decline duels button, so when you get challenged, you can click to accept/decline duels. personally i suck at duels :unsure: so this would be a great advantage to you. post if you agree.
That would just ruin the game for Duelers !!!
 

DeletedUser

Accepting/declining duels would ruin the game for duelers who tend to kick other people in fights, if it was like this, everyone would just decline.
 

DeletedUser

Accepting/declining duels would ruin the game for duelers who tend to kick other people in fights, if it was like this, everyone would just decline.

Except soldiers with über tactics.
And with those as the only exception, duelling would be void of purpose, but I guess that is what these carebears want.
 

Red Falcon

Well-Known Member
Well, maybe not EVERYONE, but there should be a way where you can view the stats of the challenger. If you think you can take him on, then by all means, accept his challenge! The worst thing that will happen if you back down is that he will call you a noob or something. Since I am stronger now than I used to be, getting dueled against is not quite as annoying to me as it used to be. If you want to be able to survive duelers, then simply make your character stronger and equip them with better weapons and armor (clothes)!
 

DeletedUser

Although I voted "it annoys me sometimes", does not mean it should not be like that - losing any game annoys me sometimes, but then I still like to play that game, including all the rules as laid out before the game started. It should be a definite NO for accepting/declining duels - duellers would not be able to duel anybody carrying lots of cash any more (no, I am not a dueller, I am an adventurer who helps against my will the duellers to also get some cash).

One thing I mentioned in another forum as well, was that I would like to see the playing field between high level duellers selecting low level targets evened out a bit. A solution could be to implement a "morale" calculation like is done in Tribal wars - it should not be too difficult to implement.
 

Red Falcon

Well-Known Member
Yes, and what might be another cool addition is to be able to see the player's names and levels when you simply hover your mouse cursor over their name, rather than having to click on the player or group of players.
 

DeletedUser

Well, maybe not EVERYONE, but there should be a way where you can view the stats of the challenger. If you think you can take him on, then by all means, accept his challenge! The worst thing that will happen if you back down is that he will call you a noob or something. Since I am stronger now than I used to be, getting dueled against is not quite as annoying to me as it used to be. If you want to be able to survive duelers, then simply make your character stronger and equip them with better weapons and armor (clothes)!

No, the worst thing that could happen is you virtually deny 2 classes of characters the opportunity to play their character the way the game was intended. You deny them the ability to do their job. That is unfair and unbalanced.
 
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