How To Eliminate Drug Cartels

I know the rules state that there can be no threads about drugs specfically, but this isn't a thread discussing drugs, but rather the current laws surrounding drugs in the United States.

It's no secret that most street drugs are illegal in the United States. Anything from cocaine, marijuana, methamphetamine, to heroin, and LSD is illegal in the United States. It's illegal to possess it, be intoxicated by it, or sell it.

How is this freedom at all? It's not. I firmly believe that it should be left to the discretion of the individual whether or not they would like to partake in such substances. Of all the money that's delegated to the prevention of illegal substances from entering the United States, it's useless. They only stop 2% of drug traffiking, is that worth the billion of dollars spent every year on the "war on drugs"?

If we were to legalize these substances, the country would instantly reap plenty of tax benefits, as well as save billions of dollars they would no longer have to spend on detecting smugglers. Not to mention, most criminal organizations would be completely crippled!

Discuss.

I would like to discuss, but so far D, what you say makes perfect sense...

I agree that legalisation of currently illicit drugs could potentially be good for society, however such substances would still need to be strongly controlled (much like currently acceptable, prescription drugs). Many of those drugs are extremely dangerous or addictive and people must be aware of the dangers, they would have to be heavily taxed, to pay for public awareness campaigns and treatment for addicts.
I certainly cannot imagine I will see these substances legalised in my lifetime.

Edit: On a more personal note, I currently find it much easier to get my hands on illegal drugs than controlled prescription medications.

The only problem with heavily taxing the substances is that it wouldn't completely cripple the drug cartels. If people can get it cheaper on the street, they will.

A small portion of the money they're currently spending on preventing drugs from entering the United States could be spent towards public awareness campaigns, rehabilitation clinics, etc.

I - too - believe that I will not see the legalization of drugs within my lifetime, but I hope that I will at least get to see one drug legalized soon: Cannibis. There's no reason that this particular drug shouldn't be legalized for recreational use immediately, especially considering that alcohol is definitely a much, much, much harder drug.

George, I hope you are a lot older than me because I would hope they are legalized in my lifetime.
On the other hand, think of all the people that would lose their meaningless jobs if we did legalize. No more payola or extortion. No more wrongful prosecution of minor drug possession. No more frivolous court hearings. No more quotas being met by cops. Things would fall apart in that sector. But, maybe, just maybe, with taxation the education system could get a boost.
That being said, maybe George is right after all.

if legalization takes place in just in just one place..it will be 'unfair' for other countries. . .on te other hand...if every country in te world will make illegal drugs like a snack in te market...what would happen? LIMITATION?

do you really think one person already addicted to drugs would find it easy to tell himself to limit te usage of what is a GOD to tat person?

i mean consideriung how hard rehabilitating can be...i dun think legalizing drug is enogh to make evryone at peace and happy

Cannibis is already decriminalised where I am. Up to 20 grams or 2 growing plants for personal use is only a fineable offence (like a parking ticket). I used to feel the same as you, but I now consider cannibis quite dangerous, it certainly ruined my life.

iggyberto said:

George, I hope you are a lot older than me because I would hope they are legalized in my lifetime.
On the other hand, think of all the people that would lose their meaningless jobs if we did legalize. No more payola or extortion. No more wrongful prosecution of minor drug possession. No more frivolous court hearings. No more quotas being met by cops. Things would fall apart in that sector. But, maybe, just maybe, with taxation the education system could get a boost.
That being said, maybe George is right after all.

Click to expand...

That's definitely the down side: Our country isn't run by what the citizens want but rather what the powers that be are bribed and coerced into imposing. On top of that, elections are a joke.

Would you like the puppet on the left or the puppet on the right?

George Hurst said:

Cannibis is already decriminalised where I am. Up to 20 grams or 2 growing plants for personal use is only a fineable offence (like a parking ticket). I used to feel the same as you, but I now consider cannibis quite dangerous, it certainly ruined my life.

Click to expand...

I'm really sorry to hear that George, but may I ask how?

Here in California you must carry a medical card (which is expensive and still not a guarantee you won't get harassed by authorities) but otherwise it's illegal still. The fines are a bit petty but the mark on your record could really ruin certain employment prospects. On top of that, the federal government is still raiding the medical marijuana establishments here in California. Even though they're completely within their legal rights within the state, that doesn't apply to federal law and as a result they're constantly being raided which really raises the price of an already expensive commodity.

Divest said:

Would you like the puppet on the left or the puppet on the right?

Click to expand...

That's the whole problem isn't it? Someone always has a hand where it doesn't belong.

i agree wit divest on tat...i dun really care much on voting another bunch idiot politicians...(but i need tat voter's ID tho) seeing as those powerful people are also part of te entire show...i dun do drug awareness program they run..its useless anyway. . .we already know what are te facts we need to know about drugs...about illegal ones...

seeing as how many lives drugs took and is taking now...id rather see people working together to make others think they dun need drugs...not even to try it out. knowing tat some of mah relatives are into it before ...it sucks to see them ruin their life and when they decided to stop...tat "dun come closer a drug addict..." thing is getting them into a push to get back on drugs again...

even if they are rehabilitated or something...there might e a time tat they cannot take it anymore and do it again..

iggyberto said:

That's the whole problem isn't it? Someone always has a hand where it doesn't belong.

Click to expand...

On top of that, did you see Obama's reaction when he was asked whether or not cannibis would be federally legalized?

He scoffed. He gave a pretentious, pompous, and condescending laugh before shaking his head and replying with: "No. No, definitely not. That's not on the books."

Which really means: We're waiting until 2011 before we start accepting campaign contributions for the 2012 election.

angelaiah013 said:

i agree wit divest on tat...i dun really care much on voting another bunch idiot politicians...(but i need tat voter's ID tho) seeing as those powerful people are also part of te entire show...i dun do drug awareness program they run..its useless anyway. . .we already know what are te facts we need to know about drugs...about illegal ones...

seeing as how many lives drugs took and is taking now...id rather see people working together to make others think they dun need drugs...not even to try it out. knowing tat some of mah relatives are into it before ...it sucks to see them ruin their life and when they decided to stop...tat "dun come closer a drug addict..." thing is getting them into a push to get back on drugs again...

even if they are rehabilitated or something...there might e a time tat they cannot take it anymore and do it again..

Click to expand...

Angel, I know you're against drugs and by no means am I trying to say that drugs are a good thing - they're not. The fact remains - however - that they do exist and that is part of reality. If someone wants the drug bad enough, they're going to get it, whether or not that means dealing with shady characters who are just as likely to murder or rob you as they are to actually provide you with a product for the money you've got on hand. Legalizing drugs would enable us to eliminate criminal organizations who thrive on the sale of illicit substances to fund their criminal activities, and to turn their ex-profits into valuable rehabilitation programs, as well as drug awareness campaigns and education.

Divest said:

On top of that, did you see Obama's reaction when he was asked whether or not cannibis would be federally legalized?

He scoffed. He gave a pretentious, pompous, and condescending laugh before shaking his head and replying with: "No. No, definitely not. That's not on the books."

Which really means: We're waiting until 2011 before we start accepting campaign contributions for the 2012 election.

Click to expand...

how gross....

IIRC Philip Morris patented several pot related names in like the 60's ...

The reason why pot isn't legalized everywhere is that you can't tax it if people grow it in their own homes. If they could tax it then pot would be legal. Ever see anyone grow their own tobacco ? If homegrown tobacco ever became widespread then tobacco would become illegal cause nobody would pay taxes on it.

Think about the growth of gambling over the last 20 years ... gambling addiction is easily as bad of a societal illness as pot but since you can tax it ... gambling is legal in alot more places now then it used to be, and it's only going to get worse ...

well..yeah ..tat is right whistling...i was once working on a tobacco industry as production worker...well everyworker can hits how many cigarettes they want on their break (pretty crazy but tat's life) kinda like a smoker's haven. . . anyway since i dun smoke we have coffees

and i find out tat there are so many dangerous effect a cigarette can have..what more if it was MJ or other drugs which is inhaled ... i really dunno what drug users get from it...

as for gambling, anyone can gamble...anyone can be on a gamble . . .for instance are those simple things lke winning a card game called pairs....at first they can be just for fun..then after sometimes they can be for money or whatever..even television shows have gambles...would you believe me if i say :who wants to be a millionaire" is also a gamble?

Whistlingleaf said:

IIRC Philip Morris patented several pot related names in like the 60's ...

The reason why pot isn't legalized everywhere is that you can't tax it if people grow it in their own homes. If they could tax it then pot would be legal. Ever see anyone grow their own tobacco ? If homegrown tobacco ever became widespread then tobacco would become illegal cause nobody would pay taxes on it.

Think about the growth of gambling over the last 20 years ... gambling addiction is easily as bad of a societal illness as pot but since you can tax it ... gambling is legal in alot more places now then it used to be, and it's only going to get worse ...

Click to expand...

Eh. That's debatable. It takes a lot of time and money to nuture a proper cannibis plant of any decent quality. Even obtaining it now, we avoid home grown pot like it's last year's fashion show.

You can brew your own beer at home and there's plenty of kits that will help you out with that but the fact is that people don't because it's difficult to match corporate commerical quality.

Even the lottery is gambling and is a recessive tax on poor people and at so much worse odds then gambling in a casino ... if people stuck their 20$ a week in the bank for 30 years they'd win something ...

"Recessive" tax means it is more costly to people of lower income cause they spend a larger percentage of their money on something then people of higher income. Same with parking tickets, speeding tickets & etc ... it's all rigged against the poorest people who can least afford to pay...

Well, I don't think they tax the lottery specifically to target "poor people" it just happens to be that the majority demographic who plays the lottery happens to be below middle class. It's probably the idea that you can spend so little ($1) and possibly win so much (millions of dollars) despite the odds. You can't win if you don't play, I've heard.

Besides, if you add up all the lottery tickets that someone would possibly buy within their lifetime, it usually doesn't add up to much.

Parking tickets and speeding tickets aren't rigged against "poor people" as far as I know. What do you mean?

angelaiah013 said:

would you believe me if i say :who wants to be a millionaire" is also a gamble?

Click to expand...

Well, it's not really a gamble on the show because the contestant really only stands to lose their dignity.

When you lump all drugs into one category the answer is going to be that the laws will stand. Taken separately on a case by case scenario cannabis might be legalized one day soon in the U.S., at least on a local level. Oregon and Alaska both have private grow laws in place so long as it is for personal use and is under a certain quantity. However, the federal government does not care about state laws and you could end up with federal charges. There are also provisions within these states for medical grow licenses. But, once again, you could face federal charges.
If legalized, more people would grow their own cannabis than would ever try to grow tobacco. Why? Pride in their strain, and there is already an infrastructure set up for home cultivation. Which is done so efficiently and discreetly nowadays it is just plain silly. In WA where I live the stats are something ludicrous like 20% grow here, and that from a 20/20 report in 95 based on a pound per capita kind of ratio. And I know for certain that is grown extensively in Canada and Mexico. I think it is a plant beyond peanuts as far as uses. (The U.S. Constitution is on hemp paper)
When I was a kid in N.M. there was a huge bust on a marijuana field. The authorities wanted to destroy it. So, someone had the bright idea of taking it to the coal power plant and burn it there. It burned so much hotter and efficiently that it almost melted the machine into one piece. Not to mention everyone that witnessed it downwind was in a great mood.
I guess if they ever do legalize it in the US it would be wise to buy stock in Dorittos.
I don't know what I am saying it was trivia night at the pub and I am tipsy. I didn't drive though.

Divest - if you took your average lotto player who spends 20$ a week and stuck all that money into the stock market for 30 years ... you'd have a substantial amount of money at the end.

I'll try to find an online calculator to give you an exact number.

Parking/speeding tickets cost a person who makes 50,000$ with a family of 4 substantially more percentage wise then it does a person making 250,000$ - that's why it's called a recessive tax on the poor.

The Lotto is even worse given that the payout is terrible ... at least if you goto Vegas you can get 98% payout rates and free drinks at the time.

Here's one article stating 55% payout - I'd guess the average is around 50%.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pennsylvania_Lottery